1000cc Sport Bike as a first motorcycle?

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Unread post by axidjw » Fri May 12, 2006 11:12 pm

not that my .02 means anything but anytime anybody gets on this board and suggests anything more than a 250 as a bike to get everybody goes into an uproar because its ludrricous to have more power than that. I agree a 1000 is a waste of money unless your doing track days becasue they are not gas savers but let me post an unbiaed opinion as i ride both cruiser and i also have a gixxer750.
In my opinion everybody wo rides a crotch rocket period is using more power than thell ever need..you can kill yourslef on a 599 just as quick as a r1 or r6 or a busa. If 250-500 is more than anyb ody ever needs why is everybody on here not got ninja 250's-im assuming not everybody here uses their bike on the track so why buy a 600/750/1000??
Its no the bikes that are dangerous its ignorrance..i bought my 750 never having been on a street bike and took about 1 month in my neighborhood learning the abailities and speed and reading, etc..that was 3 years ago..have not been in a crash..will i?? maybe?? not the point..these posts should be more on..does the bike appeal to you, are you comfortable on it? does the size of the bike make you nervous? bigger engine respect bigger responsibility and respect than a smaller one..do you want to devote the time learning the massive power the engine can produce..are you willing to fork out the astronomical money for insurance?
some of you do this but i have found most just say..its stupid to have a bike that big..it will kill you..i can use the same logic and say its stupid to have a crotch rocket of any kind..they are too powefull and you should get a small cruiser becaue its got enough power to take you to from point a to point b.
Not trying to stir the bees nest however i have been on this page for over a year now and anytime anybody asks about a "bigger bike" its like group mentality of..i better not say its ok to buy a bigger bike for a first bike becasue ill get slammed for being a "moron" or something of that nature..

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Unread post by BubbaGump » Fri May 12, 2006 11:18 pm

NorthernPete wrote:This whole thread has a trollish sorta smell to me.....

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Unread post by kabob983 » Sat May 13, 2006 11:08 am

axidjw wrote:not that my .02 means anything but anytime anybody gets on this board and suggests anything more than a 250 as a bike to get everybody goes into an uproar because its ludrricous to have more power than that. I agree a 1000 is a waste of money unless your doing track days becasue they are not gas savers but let me post an unbiaed opinion as i ride both cruiser and i also have a gixxer750.
In my opinion everybody wo rides a crotch rocket period is using more power than thell ever need..you can kill yourslef on a 599 just as quick as a r1 or r6 or a busa. If 250-500 is more than anyb ody ever needs why is everybody on here not got ninja 250's-im assuming not everybody here uses their bike on the track so why buy a 600/750/1000??
Its no the bikes that are dangerous its ignorrance..i bought my 750 never having been on a street bike and took about 1 month in my neighborhood learning the abailities and speed and reading, etc..that was 3 years ago..have not been in a crash..will i?? maybe?? not the point..these posts should be more on..does the bike appeal to you, are you comfortable on it? does the size of the bike make you nervous? bigger engine respect bigger responsibility and respect than a smaller one..do you want to devote the time learning the massive power the engine can produce..are you willing to fork out the astronomical money for insurance?
some of you do this but i have found most just say..its stupid to have a bike that big..it will kill you..i can use the same logic and say its stupid to have a crotch rocket of any kind..they are too powefull and you should get a small cruiser becaue its got enough power to take you to from point a to point b.
Not trying to stir the bees nest however i have been on this page for over a year now and anytime anybody asks about a "bigger bike" its like group mentality of..i better not say its ok to buy a bigger bike for a first bike becasue ill get slammed for being a "moron" or something of that nature..

-john-
I agree with some of what you say but consider this: when someone comes here and asks our honest opinion of "is a 1000cc sportbike a good starter bike" what should we do? Lie and make him feel good? Or should we answer his question in the way that many of us believe is correct. He came here seeking advice, all we can do is shower him with the knowledge we have. No, not everyone likes the same bikes. Yes, variety is a good thing. But I think we should at least empower these people with the knowledge of the danger that these bikes present newer riders and present an alternative solution based on our own knowledge.

You can only offer advice and suggestions, ultimately the choice is theirs. If the take the advice then great, they've just armed themselves with a much BETTER chance of learning to ride safely on a bike that is much more forgiving. If they reject the advice then that is still their decision. Hopefully that choice will not come back to bite them on the arse, but I will still wish them luck.
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Unread post by m1a1dvr » Sun May 14, 2006 10:23 am

+1 I could not agree more.

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Unread post by axidjw » Mon May 15, 2006 5:27 am

I agree. Your points are very valid and thats what i am trying to say. People who give their opinion based on riding experience is a good thing but anybody that says "dont buy a bigger bike because its stupid to do so and anybody that tells you to do so is a moron"..is just an a$$onine statement and has no merit. I know a lot of people who started on busa's.or 1800 X's...haha..Good idea? of course not, however they did not kill themselves..noobs should understand the commitment and the time it takes for a new bike and that X10 for a bigger bike..not "i didnt get a big bike to start with, so what makes you think you can do better than me, mentality" that some of these posts come off as. I don't know, maybe its just me?. I too always suggest a smaller bike but it all depends on the variables..if somebody is pushing 300lbs and they want a bike..im not going to suggest a 250cc rebel..its a waste of time, money and effort. It's just as easy to learn on a 600-800cc cruiser than a 250..its all about time and patience not the size of a engine..If you go out and buy a truck you dont go get the smallest engine you can because its your first truck, you get what best works for your needs and you start off slow with your new vehicle until you get to learn it.
Anyhow, thanks for not turning this into a stupid internet bish fest. One of the many things i enjoy about this site is that "adults" can conversate on an issue without getting childish if they are opposing opinions.

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Unread post by roscowgo » Mon May 15, 2006 8:33 am

Glad you decided to go with the smaller ride :) Its the smart thing to do.

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Unread post by camthepyro » Mon May 15, 2006 2:04 pm

axidjw
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2006 3:27 am Post subject:
I agree. Your points are very valid and thats what i am trying to say. People who give their opinion based on riding experience is a good thing but anybody that says "dont buy a bigger bike because its stupid to do so and anybody that tells you to do so is a moron"..is just an a$$onine statement and has no merit. I know a lot of people who started on busa's.or 1800 X's...haha..Good idea? of course not, however they did not kill themselves..noobs should understand the commitment and the time it takes for a new bike and that X10 for a bigger bike..not "i didnt get a big bike to start with, so what makes you think you can do better than me, mentality" that some of these posts come off as. I don't know, maybe its just me?. I too always suggest a smaller bike but it all depends on the variables..if somebody is pushing 300lbs and they want a bike..im not going to suggest a 250cc rebel..its a waste of time, money and effort. It's just as easy to learn on a 600-800cc cruiser than a 250..its all about time and patience not the size of a engine..If you go out and buy a truck you dont go get the smallest engine you can because its your first truck, you get what best works for your needs and you start off slow with your new vehicle until you get to learn it.
Anyhow, thanks for not turning this into a stupid internet bish fest. One of the many things i enjoy about this site is that "adults" can conversate on an issue without getting childish if they are opposing opinions.

-john-
Well, when I tell people not to go over 500cc, I'm usually talking to the people who want sport bikes. It's the same as cars, how many people think it's a good idea to learn how to drive a car in a Ferrari? When I started to learn how to drive, I almost bought an old Camaro IROC-Z, which is a 5.7 liter V8. My cousin told me that was a bad idea, because of the shear power of the it, and I could easily make a mistake, hit the gas, and hit a tree. Now, my current bike ('82 Nighthawk 450) can accelerate much faster than that Camaro. So if it's not a good idea to start off on a car that fast, than just starting out a 450 is dangerous, but not nearly as dangerous as an R6 or R1.

I think the reason most people want to start out on those bikes, is because they don't really understand how much power they have (at least not compared to something they understand, like a car). And they don't understand that even the "small" bikes are very fast (I'm talking over 250cc here, not those little 125s we used in the MSF class).

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Unread post by satriani » Mon May 15, 2006 4:31 pm

King Frog wrote:Buy the BIKE YOU WANT for a first bike. There is no need to waste your money on "training bikes" . You can learn to ride on any bike. IF you want a 1000cc sport bike....and an insure it......Buy it. Practice with it and enjoy it.

You'll learn soon enough yours and the bike limitations. You WILL grow out of anything less then a 750 within months if not weeks.
Are you serious? :roll:

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Unread post by kabob983 » Mon May 15, 2006 8:30 pm

camthepyro wrote:I think the reason most people want to start out on those bikes, is because they don't really understand how much power they have (at least not compared to something they understand, like a car). And they don't understand that even the "small" bikes are very fast (I'm talking over 250cc here, not those little 125s we used in the MSF class).
Most people compare the power of a bike with the power of a car. What they fail to see is that a bike may way 1/10th what a car does. I drive a 115 hp Honda Civic. A 115 HP GSX-R600 will have the same "power" as the Civic in their minds. What they fail to realize is that a gixxer is MADE to go fast. A Civic is MADE to be a fuel efficient transportation vehicle.
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Unread post by Sev » Mon May 15, 2006 11:00 pm

I civic weighs close to 2 tons. Pushed by 115hp, a Gixxer weighs 400lbs pushed by 115 hp...
Of course I'm generalizing from a single example here, but everyone does that. At least I do.

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Unread post by skoebl » Mon May 15, 2006 11:24 pm

Sevulturus wrote:I civic weighs close to 2 tons. Pushed by 115hp, a Gixxer weighs 400lbs pushed by 115 hp...
A civic weighs almost 4,000 lbs? :shock:

My girlfriend's aveo is only like one ton...
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Unread post by camthepyro » Tue May 16, 2006 12:36 am

The gixxer is lighter then 400 pounds...

Plus, think about all the crap you keep in your car, that's got to be a couple of hundred pounds of crap just in sitting in your trunk and back seat.

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Unread post by PackRider » Tue May 16, 2006 10:39 am

One of the great things about motorcycles is since they don't cost all that much you don't have to buy just one for the rest of your life.

I bought a used GS500F last year as a first bike and love it. I'm currently accepting offers if anyone is interested because I'd like to move up to a SV650S. I'm also dreaming of a SV1000 or TL1000.

I think people are sometimes too concerned about "outgrowing" a Ninja 250 or 500 or a GS500, like they can never sell it and buy another bike. Get a GS500F, have fun, attract girls who don't care what it is so long as it's a bike, then when you're ready sell it and buy another bike. You might even find the 500 is all you need and keep it.
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Unread post by kabob983 » Tue May 16, 2006 12:50 pm

camthepyro wrote:The gixxer is lighter then 400 pounds...
The new GSX-R600 weighs 407 lbs dry.

And no civic weighs 4000lbs, maybe 1.25 tons or so...
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Unread post by skoebl » Wed May 17, 2006 10:15 am

kabob983 wrote: And no civic weighs 4000lbs, maybe 1.25 tons or so...
That's what I thought lol
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Unread post by camthepyro » Wed May 17, 2006 1:30 pm

kabob983
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 10:50 am Post subject:
camthepyro wrote:
The gixxer is lighter then 400 pounds...


The new GSX-R600 weighs 407 lbs dry.

And no civic weighs 4000lbs, maybe 1.25 tons or so...
On suzuki's website it says the GSX-R600 has a dry weight of 354lbs, although I admit, I thought it was lower than that, but it's still less than 400.
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Unread post by kabob983 » Wed May 17, 2006 1:44 pm

camthepyro wrote:
kabob983
PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2006 10:50 am Post subject:
camthepyro wrote:
The gixxer is lighter then 400 pounds...


The new GSX-R600 weighs 407 lbs dry.

And no civic weighs 4000lbs, maybe 1.25 tons or so...
On suzuki's website it says the GSX-R600 has a dry weight of 354lbs, although I admit, I thought it was lower than that, but it's still less than 400.
(I hate getting my "info" from here) but on a "Supersport Shootout" they listed the 2006 GSX-R600 weighing in at 407lbs.

Now I'm not going to say it's the most reliable of sources, but weight seems like one of the few tests that should be reasonably accurate and unbiased...

www.motorcycleusa.com is where I saw that.



Oh, and I checked with Honda's website. The new Civic weighs in at around 2600 lbs, just about the 1.25 tons I guessed.
Last edited by kabob983 on Wed May 17, 2006 1:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread post by DivideOverflow » Wed May 17, 2006 1:46 pm

kabob983 wrote:
(I hate getting my "info" from here) but on a "Supersport Shootout" they listed the 2006 GSX-R600 weighing in at 407lbs.

Now I'm not going to say it's the most reliable of sources, but weight seems like one of the few tests that should be reasonably accurate and unbiased...

www.motorcycleusa.com is where I saw that.
That would be the wet weight (with all the fluids and such (gas, oil, radiator fluid, etc). Manufacturer's dry weight numbers are usually a lot less than when the bike hits the street. So 407lbs ready to go sounds about right.
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Unread post by kabob983 » Wed May 17, 2006 1:51 pm

Well, we're both 1/2 right. It's not wet or dry weight, it's "empty tank" weight.

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Unread post by badfish89 » Mon May 22, 2006 8:26 pm

my first bike is a buell firebolt XB12r. That is 1203 cc's and it prolly has les HP than your bike. But still a lot. I learned on a smaller bike though.
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