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They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 4:40 am
by JC Viper
An old childhood friend finally decided to start riding since I and his other friends have been riding for a while with me being the most experienced with years and racing school.

Anyhow I tried to start him off right once he got his permit and told him to get a 250 or 500cc sport bike with an SV650 being the most. His other friend told him to start off on a super bike like an R6 because he'll grow out of smaller bikes and that it wouldn't be too hard to control with some practice. Well my friend went ahead and bought an R6 despite my warnings but since he was determined on keeping it I just stuck with his choice and offered to help him improve his skill.

While I was out of commission with the 750 giving me problems his other friend had taken over in teaching him how to ride since he claims to be really good at it despite only having a permit for such a long time. My friend would always come to me about techniques in a book I lent him and I would give him some examples using his bike. When we always talked about anything related to riding he would always tell me how he's scared of inattentive drivers, road debris and just plain losing control and I just coached him like my instructors coached me and he swore to never be a squid to the point of dressing in armor like I would.

After I bought another bike I decided to hit my friend up to go riding and to see his progress. His friends came along with their bikes and we rode around on local roads for a bit. He did well despite being on high powered bike. That is until we decided to hit the highway. Once there he and his other friends just jacked up their speeds and began swerving in and out of traffic. Even though they were using their signals they were passing way too close which I considered what they were doing was cutting people off. I on the other hand maintained a decent clip, a bit faster than traffic, signaled and did proper lane changes. The others ended up having to wait for me at the next junction and this game kept repeating until we got to the destination and on the way back. This would happen the next time I went riding with them.

Now they just stopped calling me to go riding and whenever I would ask if they were going out for a ride or just to go hang out they would give me a nice run around and I would end up staying home for the night. They were annoyed at having to wait for me and being a wuss and started mocking me about my training at the super bike school and riding experience. At that point I gave up on them and told my friend to go to hell whenever he would ask me things bike related and I made sure to get my books back.

Speeding and cutting people off and riding too aggressively is not skill, it's called being a jerk to other road users not to mention being a jerk (the filter didn't use another word for d*ck so I decided to use jerk) to yourself because after all who gets hurt in a crash? Well now I'm back to being without riding buddies which sucks because I was hoping to go places like the beach this summer with people instead of by myself. :rant:

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:11 am
by Gummiente
There are old riders and there are bold riders, but there are no old, bold riders. You made the right choice, even if it means riding solo for awhile, because YOU will live longer. Kudos to you.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 2:22 pm
by Gunslinger
Sounds like they weren't good friends to begin with. Keep riding like an azz long enough and bad things are going to happen. Don't worry dude, you will make new friends. The first time one of my buddies makes fun of my riding style would be the last time. Not cool.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 3:08 pm
by JC Viper
They are the type who believes that their loud pipes will save them from being cut off. Ironically they would be the ones cutting people off and I witnessed when one of them did get cut off but he was riding in a blind spot even when I warned him about doing so. They have their fears while riding yet they ride up on someone's bumper before they pass. Considering that they do this in their cars as well it should have been no surprise to me.

Riding aggressively is fine to a point but when you cause other road users to panic it only shows motorcycles in a negative light. If one of them did get into a crash and gets hurt pretty bad they'll probably be the type to have a crusade against motorcycles deeming them dangerous. Again not good for the sport and will only make insurance premiums skyrocket some more in my state/ city.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 6:42 pm
by RhadamYgg
Wow, that sucks. I really can't keep up with most riders on the highway. I tend to be very particular about my space cushion and clearance for passing. Occasionally, I'll make a higher risk pass to prevent myself from being boxed in. But this kind of maneuver isn't zigging and zagging through traffic. It is a study of the traffic pattern - wait, look and accelerate and pass - then re-stabilize my speed.

That last bit is important for me - in my car I got caught speeding @ 90 mph because I accelerate to get around a guy that just wandered in to the left most lane and never lowered my speed again. We'll see how much it increases my insurance and if I'll still be able to ride or if I have to take a break for a couple years. Fortunately, it was in NY state and the most I can get is 2 points. But still, I've been without an incident on my license for 8 years or so.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 7:39 pm
by BRUMBEAR
You did the right thing.
Plain and simple I have lived and worked in NJ/NYC area all my life these highways are no place to ride like that. If a dumptruck dropping stone a tractor loosing a retread or a muffler don't get you some mom on a cell phone cager will.
The group I run with can move at a very good clip it's always on backroads where there are very few cars. I tell truth here I run all day and will never see triple digits and I guarentee those guys you are talking about would be shiting there draws inside of 10 minutes. Can I do 150mph sure but not on the street most modern motorcycles can achieve 120mph fairly easily, but can the rider do 60 on a 30mph suggested road.
One of the guys I ride with who raced for factory Suzuki a few years ago and even won a gold medal at the ISDT said it best
Any fool can twist a wick the skills riding is where the men are seperated from the boys.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 07, 2010 8:48 pm
by MZ33
Yeah, they have become squids. Sorry you lost your riding group. But at least you'll get to be able to ride longer. Visit them at the hospital, the long-term care facility, or the cemetary, when you get a chance.

People are gonna do what they are gonna do. Can't fix that.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 7:03 pm
by storysunfolding
I've won race series in both WERA and CCS, and I teach track classes to get you a race license. I just finished up a class where my laptimes were consistently 8 seconds faster than my fellow instructors.

On the street I ride like a girl. Doesn't matter if it's on the interstate or on backroads. Both places have guard rails, traffic, possible debris on the road and many fixed immobile objects. I'll never go faster than 20 over regardless of how fast I "know" I can take it. The street is no place for performance riding and anyone that says otherwise can go ride somewhere else. If they're too poor for track time, screw em- just don't let them bring you down.

:thumbsup: to you man.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 8:49 pm
by MZ33
storysunfolding wrote: On the street I ride like a girl.
Gee, thanks.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Thu Jul 08, 2010 9:54 pm
by storysunfolding
Reasonably, skilled and responsibly?

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 7:40 am
by jstark47
storysunfolding wrote:Reasonably, skilled and responsibly?
:diggin: Put the shovel down, storys! Yer a marked man now, and yer just makin' the hole deeper.... :LOL2:


JC Viper wrote:Well now I'm back to being without riding buddies which sucks because I was hoping to go places like the beach this summer with people instead of by myself. :rant:
Truth told, after 5 years riding I hardly ever ride with others anymore, except for Mrs. Stark. Once or twice a year with the local RAT pack, but that's usually just 4-5 guys, all very experienced. Riding in groups is overrated, just my 2 cents.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Fri Jul 09, 2010 11:23 am
by BuzZz
I almost always ride alone. And always have.

When your modus operandi is 'no wittnesses', bringing a group of them with you doesn't make much sense. :lol:

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Sat Jul 10, 2010 4:09 am
by JC Viper
It sucks though because it would've been cool to just cruise around and then do some spirited riding on back roads. It would've been nice to chill out with people during stops and just go places instead of the usual of me alone such as riding to the beach. Besides the group wasn't that big, just me and 4 other guys. The sad thing is when I did ride with them I would catch up on the curves when they would be hitting the breaks standing their bikes up. Then at stop lights I would cringe a bit because they would love to blip their throttles with some of them revving the engine outright.

I'm not a slow rider but I've crashed enough at low speeds or even when stopped and crashing at high speeds on a busy highway is really not an option. Besides I have experienced that anything more than a 1/4 throttle in 6th gear on my bike will have me reaching speeds of 120 MPH in a matter of seconds and it gets much worse in 5th. (well unless you really want to reach 100 mph that quickly and yes I do have my naughty moments but mostly near the local air field).

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Sat Jul 10, 2010 7:49 am
by storysunfolding
Find another group of riders. Plenty of bike nights clubs and local riding forums out there

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 12:13 am
by flw
Maturity of the rider seems to be the key to a good person to ride with or maturity of the group at large. It may or may not come with age as I've seen my share of 50 year old's riding like teenagers in their Dad's new sports car. Younger riders can be and some are safe but it seems to be a exception rather than the rule.

I ride on my own because the people I do know with bikes are different people when riding. They talk a good safety game but not when when they are actually riding. For me it is the ride not the destination. Why hurry, to end the ride sooner ?

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Sun Jul 11, 2010 2:00 pm
by RhadamYgg
You know, (IMHO) you don't need to ride with anyone else. Not once have I ridden with someone else. I get a little companionship once in a while with someone on the highway and then after a while they either outrisk/outride me or they get off the highway (I'm on it for so many miles that it is rare that I get off the highway before the other rider).

It is kind of like one of those cowboy movies. He saw a woman hanging clothes in the distance and it was great. The other guy says 'Didn't you go meet her?' and the old cowboy was like 'nope, figured it could never get any better than that.'

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 2:54 am
by JC Viper
Yeah that's true. I always did ride alone and for a bit I thought it would be great to just chill out with more people and travel to different places together. Only problem was we never really stopped in interesting places and when we did rest at something pretty decent we wouldn't relax there too long as they wanted to tear up the highway some more and then head home that is if they didn't get clipped (which almost happens quite a bit since they do 90MPH on short on-ramp roads with moderate traffic). Of course they might be riding differently during the day time as they never call me to go riding with them until nightfall and by then they usually had ridden a couple of hours already. This would be on the weekends when we all managed to get those days off.

It's funny how they would give me advice on riding yet they can't do certain techniques because they find it hard to do unless it was done on a lighter bike. I guess the writers of Proficient Motorcycling and Total Control don't know what they're talking about...

And the stupidity ensues as they say BMW cannot make a 6 cylinder bike because it's impossible for weight and handling purposes meanwhile they can't believe that Honda made a 6 cyl. bike and still maintain it was for concept only. Just because they're average mechanics doesn't mean they know all... :rant:

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 9:02 am
by fireguzzi
JC Viper wrote:.

And the stupidity ensues as they say BMW cannot make a 6 cylinder bike because it's impossible for weight and handling purposes meanwhile they can't believe that Honda made a 6 cyl. bike and still maintain it was for concept only. Just because they're average mechanics doesn't mean they know all... :rant:
Did make and still do.....tell your buddies to look up the specs for a Goldwing.

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:46 pm
by Wrider
And the CBX 1100.
Goldwing, Valkyrie, and Rune are all Flat-6s and the CBX was an inline 6.
Honda also made an engine for racing with oval pistons that was originally either a V12 or V8 but rules limited it to half the cylinders it was designed for, so they still used all of the conrods but just took out the cylinder wall between the pistons to make it fit the rules. Revved to like 20K with valve springs!

Re: They've become squids...

Posted: Wed Jul 14, 2010 7:38 pm
by BRUMBEAR
I ride with or without groups. In groups I like knowing if I go down there is someone to help you out or if you have a mechanical problem. I also like riding solo sometimes it is just a great way to get "sorted out"