You are a Beginner and want a 600cc+ sportbike? READ THIS!

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Apollofrost
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#81 Unread post by Apollofrost » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:25 am

Good luck and buy some good gear just in case.
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Re: Looking to buy a bike.

#82 Unread post by jonnythan » Wed Apr 04, 2007 12:37 am

jackc34 wrote:
Scoutmedic wrote:
jackc34 wrote:Hi,I'm just buying my first motorcycle,I wanted a Sport bike,I saw 2006 Honda Intercepter on the Honda site,But after reading the post about 600cc bikes and beginers I thought I should ask you guys what would be a good bike,

My other choice even though it's not as cool looking was the Ninja 250.

Can you guys give me any seggustions? :?
Have you checked out the Beginner's Guide? There are also stickies and the Learn To Ride A Motorcycle page which is now downloadable in PDF format (Created and maintained by Dragonhawk).

Yea,Well I've decided on a 2007 Honda CBR600cc Supersport,I've heard all this stuff about the 600cc,but I'm going for it.anyways thanks for the tips.Wish me luck.
This is kind of like buying a Formula 1 car as your first car. I'm not even exaggerating. It really is.

Good luck, buy quality gear, and wear it every time you get on the bike.
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Re: Looking to buy a bike.

#83 Unread post by Sev » Wed Apr 04, 2007 1:01 am

jonnythan wrote:
jackc34 wrote:
Scoutmedic wrote:
jackc34 wrote:Hi,I'm just buying my first motorcycle,I wanted a Sport bike,I saw 2006 Honda Intercepter on the Honda site,But after reading the post about 600cc bikes and beginers I thought I should ask you guys what would be a good bike,

My other choice even though it's not as cool looking was the Ninja 250.

Can you guys give me any seggustions? :?
Have you checked out the Beginner's Guide? There are also stickies and the Learn To Ride A Motorcycle page which is now downloadable in PDF format (Created and maintained by Dragonhawk).

Yea,Well I've decided on a 2007 Honda CBR600cc Supersport,I've heard all this stuff about the 600cc,but I'm going for it.anyways thanks for the tips.Wish me luck.
This is kind of like buying a Formula 1 car as your first car. I'm not even exaggerating. It really is.

Good luck, buy quality gear, and wear it every time you get on the bike.
No... buying a motogp bike would be like buying a formula one race car.

I don't think it's a good idea, but I learned a long time ago that you're not going to convince someone of their own mortality... or lack of experience. So, imo it's his money to do with as he likes, and he's welcome to take style as the only consideration when buying a bike. Hopefully he'll fall into the smaller portion of this group and not get hurt because of the bike. But only time will tell.
Of course I'm generalizing from a single example here, but everyone does that. At least I do.

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#84 Unread post by Nalian » Wed Apr 04, 2007 2:35 pm

Peter Y wrote:
Nalian wrote:Peter - you have your opinion and others have theirs. I don't think you're going to prove anything going on a tangent. ;)
U know considering the online bashing I got I think im being totally mild in my response. But wait give it a day or so Im going to come back with some interesting data for your folks to review. Same topic same circumstances and differing views. I just think you need to question the status quo and not be "conditioned" to just agree with what you read or others say. :mrgreen:
I'm not 'conditioned' nor am I just accepting the status quo. I agree with the reasoning that it is not the smart thing to do to buy a bike with crazy amounts of horsepower for your first bike. When you're learning to ride on the street, there are so many variables that can go wrong. I don't see any reason to add another thing that can go wrong to it.

You feel comfortable with something more than that after your 4 months of training - awesome, I'm glad you feel that way. It's your body and you can do whatever you want to it. However, I would tell anyone I loved or cared about to start with something 60 hp or under. My own experiences with riding bikes of various power, etc, tell me that it is the best set of advice I can give to someone new. You telling me that a bunch of dudes in some other country disagree doesn't really mean anything, as I've based my opinion on my own experiences. Their experiences and conclusions are likely different, and that's fine.

My comment to you was because you're repeatedly debating with folks who have their minds made up, likely because of their own experiences. If you have actual new information such as statistics or something to bring to the table..awesome. Please do so. If you want to repeatedly go "nu uh, these other guys said you're wrong!" then I think you're wasting people's time. By all means, keep doing so if that makes you happy. But I do think you're wasting your time.

It's a pretty bad assumption to think that people who disagree with you are doing so only because they are going along with what others have said, rather than their own experiences.

BTW - your katana has a rear wheel horsepower estimates at 65-68, which is nowhere near the 600cc supersports mentioned that this entire topic is about. Plenty of them are double your bike.

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#85 Unread post by Fast Eddy B » Wed Apr 04, 2007 2:53 pm

Good stuff, ride the Katana. Should have low power and torque at low RPM to not flip it, and with Euro training, and more good attention and training, some good fun.

As far as changing peoples minds here, mmmm, we'll see. As far as measuring them, you have all the info you need.

Later!
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#86 Unread post by Peter Y » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:05 am

It's a pretty bad assumption to think that people who disagree with you are doing so only because they are going along with what others have said, rather than their own experiences.

BTW - your katana has a rear wheel horsepower estimates at 65-68, which is nowhere near the 600cc supersports mentioned that this entire topic is about. Plenty of them are double your bike
OK I think you have captured the key pieces that are causing me the biggest frustration. You yourself say that the bike I have purchased is no comparison to a supersports 600cc. I have said this numerous times in my comments also but it was falling on deaf ears. I also pointed out the different circumstances i was in ( In Europe/training etc) At the end thats why I posted a picture of my bike. Hoping the visual aspect might help people put reason to my logic.

The reason I think people were being influenced by others also is because a majority of the responses would also quote a previous response and back it up with additional commentary.

To be fair I did get responses also confirming that a Katana was a timid 600cc and it was not as dangerous as a supersports but these were at minimal.

Im just trying to say that You cant just say NO to a 600CC without understanding the underlying details (Katana vs GSX-RR etc ). I strongly feel that this is whats happened here.Im not going to give up on this as I believe im right and I have enought confidence in myself to keep pushing the point until this is acknowledged. I didnt go out and buy a race bike.

PS: I watched your blog. Its cool 8)

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#87 Unread post by Peter Y » Thu Apr 05, 2007 7:12 am

Fast Eddy B wrote:Good stuff, ride the Katana. Should have low power and torque at low RPM to not flip it, and with Euro training, and more good attention and training, some good fun.

As far as changing peoples minds here, mmmm, we'll see. As far as measuring them, you have all the info you need.

Later!
Eddy,

Thanks a million for your supportive comments. Im absolutley committed in getting this right. I didnt buy a F1 bike. I got a "sunday riders" bike. Nice weather, lazy sunday afternoon "lets ride" ( I hope I havent pissed off other Katana riders by saying this :laughing: ).

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#88 Unread post by Nalian » Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:21 am

Peter Y wrote:OK I think you have captured the key pieces that are causing me the biggest frustration. You yourself say that the bike I have purchased is no comparison to a supersports 600cc. I have said this numerous times in my comments also but it was falling on deaf ears. I also pointed out the different circumstances i was in ( In Europe/training etc) At the end thats why I posted a picture of my bike. Hoping the visual aspect might help people put reason to my logic.
Absolutely. It's important to look at the horsepower/power output of the bike, not the engine size, etc. Your bike is borderline but I think people can do OK on it. After 4 months of training that you went through I don't see an issue with it at all. Whomever said that training is the same in the US as it is there is dead wrong.
Peter Y wrote:The reason I think people were being influenced by others also is because a majority of the responses would also quote a previous response and back it up with additional commentary.

To be fair I did get responses also confirming that a Katana was a timid 600cc and it was not as dangerous as a supersports but these were at minimal.
I think it was likely more of a lack of knowledge about the bike you were getting and its power output. Most people who want 600CC sportbikes are not looking at the katana..they're looking at the cbr's, r6's, etc.
Peter Y wrote:Im just trying to say that You cant just say NO to a 600CC without understanding the underlying details (Katana vs GSX-RR etc ). I strongly feel that this is whats happened here.Im not going to give up on this as I believe im right and I have enought confidence in myself to keep pushing the point until this is acknowledged. I didnt go out and buy a race bike.
I agree with you there - its always best to know what you're getting into. But, I think my original point still stands. I'm not sure what your goal in continuing to debate it is - do you want all the people who told you it was a bad idea for a first bike to come back and say you were right? I guess your crusade is just confusing me - although your fervor is second to none with this!

Peter Y wrote:PS: I watched your blog. Its cool 8)


Thanks :oops:

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#89 Unread post by Peter Y » Thu Apr 05, 2007 8:43 am

Nalian
I'm not sure what your goal in continuing to debate it is - do you want all the people who told you it was a bad idea for a first bike to come back and say you were right? I guess your crusade is just confusing me - although your fervor is second to none with this!
U know all I want is for people to understand they should not go out and just "generalise" about a certain topic without reading through the facts.

Not everyone is as passionate about issues as I am. I can imagine others who were absolutley right in their postings have received similar treamtment. Not everyone has the confidence to "fight" back as I have to prove a point. What then? Group pressure overpowers the minority views?

I must say I wouldnt mind those people who absolutley dammed my decision with my bike to come back and say "ooppss you got a point". but that will never happen. Their just probably reading this string whilst continuing to have "great" thoughts about me. :laughing: :laughing:

I HAVE A DREAM THAT ONE DAY PEOPLE WILL BE FROWNED UPON FOR HAVING THE WRONG TYPE OF 600CC FOR A FIRST BIKE RATHER THAN JUST HAVING A 600CC AS A FIRST BIKE :laughing: :laughing: .

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#90 Unread post by DivideOverflow » Thu Apr 05, 2007 9:54 am

Peter Y wrote:
Nalian
I'm not sure what your goal in continuing to debate it is - do you want all the people who told you it was a bad idea for a first bike to come back and say you were right? I guess your crusade is just confusing me - although your fervor is second to none with this!
U know all I want is for people to understand they should not go out and just "generalise" about a certain topic without reading through the facts.

Not everyone is as passionate about issues as I am. I can imagine others who were absolutley right in their postings have received similar treamtment. Not everyone has the confidence to "fight" back as I have to prove a point. What then? Group pressure overpowers the minority views?

I must say I wouldnt mind those people who absolutley dammed my decision with my bike to come back and say "ooppss you got a point". but that will never happen. Their just probably reading this string whilst continuing to have "great" thoughts about me. :laughing: :laughing:

I HAVE A DREAM THAT ONE DAY PEOPLE WILL BE FROWNED UPON FOR HAVING THE WRONG TYPE OF 600CC FOR A FIRST BIKE RATHER THAN JUST HAVING A 600CC AS A FIRST BIKE :laughing: :laughing: .
Yeah, yeah, so you bought a Katana... good for you. I still wouldn't recommend that for a first bike for American riders. I usually stick to the 50/500 rule (under 50 hp and under 500 lbs). With your 4 months euro experience (which you didn't mention in the first place), you are probably fine, but 99% of the riders on here don't get that kind of treatment. The katana has over 50 hp, and is very close to 500 lbs. More importantly, it carries its weight in an awkward top-heavy fashion that I don't recommend for new riders.

You like your bike, good for you. You still won't get me to recommend it to someone who is a true beginner as their first bike.
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#91 Unread post by Peter Y » Thu Apr 05, 2007 10:07 am

DivideOverflow wrote:
Yeah, yeah, so you bought a Katana... good for you. I still wouldn't recommend that for a first bike for American riders. I usually stick to the 50/500 rule (under 50 hp and under 500 lbs). With your 4 months euro experience (which you didn't mention in the first place), you are probably fine, but 99% of the riders on here don't get that kind of treatment. The katana has over 50 hp, and is very close to 500 lbs. More importantly, it carries its weight in an awkward top-heavy fashion that I don't recommend for new riders.

You like your bike, good for you. You still won't get me to recommend it to someone who is a true beginner as their first bike.
Come on Divide Overflow I do sense you "reconsidering" your previous comments. Maybe you were just too much of a hard "O Ring" and should have read all the related threads before you jumped all over me. Dont be a dinasour, theres nothing wrong with embracing alternative views.

Never the less I still LUV YA..... :laughing: :laughing:

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#92 Unread post by DivideOverflow » Thu Apr 05, 2007 1:21 pm

Peter Y wrote: Come on Divide Overflow I do sense you "reconsidering" your previous comments. Maybe you were just too much of a hard "O Ring" and should have read all the related threads before you jumped all over me. Dont be a dinasour, theres nothing wrong with embracing alternative views.

Never the less I still LUV YA..... :laughing: :laughing:
I didn't conceed on anything new... I said this 4 pages ago: "First of all, I noticed that you got a GSX 600... that is a katana, that isn't a race replica bike. It is generally considered the slower version. However, it is a top heavy pig, and I rarely suggest those bikes to anyone, regardless of riding ability. "

I don't have anything else to conceed... Everything else I said I stand by. It was you that was arguing that a 4 cylinder sports car offers as much of a threat as a RWD V8, and that a smaller bike is more likely to flip, so you should get a bigger one! You are the one that needs to embrace reality. I read all the related threads as I was one of the first ones to respond. I still think you are just trolling to get some kind of satisfaction.

Also, how am I a dinosaur? I'm like 23 years old... It is just that I've seen people with a lot more experience than beginners get hurt on 600cc+ sportbikes. And if you would have actually read what people post here, you would see that we are referring to race replica bikes that put out close to 100 hp. But that wouldn't be any fun would it? Reading what was actually said can be such a bore.

You aren't changing anyone's mind. The Katana is better than the GSXR, but it is still a crummy first bike. I would have picked the ninja 650R as a better beginner bike, and that has more ccs. What it also has is a more user-friendly powerband, it is lighter, and is more beginner friendly. However, I still consider that a better second bike. I stick to my under 50hp and 500lbs rule...

So, read this very carefully, it should make you happy: Engine size is not as important as power output when choosing a first bike. It just happens to be that the majority of kids want 600cc + sportbikes, which put out a lot of horsepower, which makes them poor to learn on (not to mention the extreme handling characteristics, poor slow speed maneuverability, and high insurance costs).
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#93 Unread post by Peter Y » Thu Apr 05, 2007 2:06 pm

DivideOverflow

And if you would have actually read what people post here, you would see that we are referring to race replica bikes that put out close to 100 hp. But that wouldn't be any fun would it? Reading what was actually said can be such a bore.
It was in one of my first posts that i said the bike was a GSX 600F (Katana). Despite that I got all the aggressive online bashing. At the end it was the picture that I posted that made the difference.

I dont care how old you are your still a dinasour to me. Someone your age should be able to embrace differing views and be able to decipher key pieces of information in a post that change the outcome. You were unable to do that. Your not a teacher a mentor nor an instructor. Learn how to be facilitating and non confronting in your views.

Despite all this though I still LUV YA... If you ever come to Amsterdam I would be happy to take you for a ride on my Katana. :twisted: :twisted:

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Hey guys just thought I tell you about this.

#94 Unread post by jackc34 » Fri Apr 06, 2007 4:13 am

Listen I did some checking and I found another bike I'm interested in,

It's still a over a 60cc.lol,But it's smaller than a 600cc

I saw this last night,It's a Untied Motors 2007 V2S-250R

Image

Here's the Specs on it.

Powerful 72 degree V-twin, 8 valve, Dual over head cam engine.
10.4:1 compression ratio.
Five speed constant mesh, easy shifting transmission.
Multi plate, wet manual clutch.
Modern perimeter frame chassis.
Front dual disk brakes, rear single disk, light weight cast aluminum wheels.
Compression and pre load adjustable “inverted” front forks.
Pre load adjustable rear mono shock .
Fully adjustable rear sets (foot rests).
Full sport fairing with projector headlamps, digital gauges, clip on handle bars, rear passenger hand rails and convenient under seat storage.
Convenient bungee hooks and helmet hooks are also provided.
MSRP $3,699.00 plus freight and dealer prep.
EPA & CARB certified.

TYPE

SPORT
ENGINE TYPE
249CC, 4-STROKE, 2-CYL, 72 V-TWIN

BORE AND STROKE (mm)
57 X 48.8
COMPRESSION RATIO
10.4: 1

COOLING
AIR/OIL

IGNITION
CDI

TRANSMISSION
5 SPEED

FINAL DRIVE
CHAIN

STARTING SYSTEM
ELECTRIC
FUEL DELIVERY
(2) 22mm MIKUNI CARBURETORS
FRONT SUSPENSION
TELESCOPIC FORK

REAR SUSPENSION
SWINGARM

FRONT BRAKE
DUAL DISC

REAR BRAKE
DISC

FRONT TIRE
110/70 X 17 54H

REAR TIRE
150/70 x 17 69H

DIMENSIONS (LxWxH)
81.9" X 25.78" X 42.9"

SEAT HEIGHT
31.3"

WHEELBASE
56.5"

FUEL CAPACITY (GAL)
4.5

DRY WEIGHT
390 LBS

WARRANTY
3 YEAR POWERTRAIN, 18 MONTHS ALL PARTS

COLORS
BLACK, SILVER, RED, BURGUNDY

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Re: Hey guys just thought I tell you about this.

#95 Unread post by Peter Y » Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:28 am

Listen I did some checking and I found another bike I'm interested in,

It's still a over a 60cc.lol,But it's smaller than a 600cc

I saw this last night,It's a Untied Motors 2007 V2S-250R
Does it have a 600cc or 750CC version :laughing: :laughing:

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#96 Unread post by DivideOverflow » Fri Apr 06, 2007 5:49 am

re: the Untied Motors 2007 V2S-250R

Technically, that is a good bike to start with. It looks like a good alternative to the Ninja 250. Make sure there is a dealer that can get you parts close to your area! The hardest thing about those "off brands" is getting parts and service when something goes wrong.
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Re: Hey guys just thought I tell you about this.

#97 Unread post by jackc34 » Fri Apr 06, 2007 7:42 am

Peter Y wrote:
Listen I did some checking and I found another bike I'm interested in,

It's still a over a 60cc.lol,But it's smaller than a 600cc

I saw this last night,It's a Untied Motors 2007 V2S-250R
Does it have a 600cc or 750CC version :laughing: :laughing:
Well as a matter of fact,It comes in a 250cc or 650cc.

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There's one close

#98 Unread post by jackc34 » Fri Apr 06, 2007 7:44 am

DivideOverflow wrote:re: the Untied Motors 2007 V2S-250R

Technically, that is a good bike to start with. It looks like a good alternative to the Ninja 250. Make sure there is a dealer that can get you parts close to your area! The hardest thing about those "off brands" is getting parts and service when something goes wrong.

There's a dealer 20 mins from where I live. :D

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#99 Unread post by Apollofrost » Fri Apr 06, 2007 8:49 am

That thing looks SWEEET!
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#100 Unread post by b!keR » Fri Apr 06, 2007 9:37 am

as I can see...everybody on this forum are scared of SUPERSPORTS bikes. :mrgreen:

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