2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Coolness Factor = 74%

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Jarlaxle
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Jarlaxle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 1:16 pm

Actually, no, there was no "de-restricted" version available. The Direct Connection computer INCREASED boost.

This is why big power increases are relatively easy on ANY boosted engine...like the H2R.

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Sun Oct 05, 2014 2:26 pm

Jarlaxle wrote:Actually, no, there was no "de-restricted" version available. The Direct Connection computer INCREASED boost.

This is why big power increases are relatively easy on ANY boosted engine...like the H2R.
This is getting to be a circular argument here.

There are many other factors for increasing a engine from 200 HP to 300 HP than just changing the "chip". If it was that easy, it would be done all the time. You are more than welcome to keep increasing the boost on your 200 HP engine until it blows itself to smithereen...well before it reaches anywhere near 300 HP.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Jarlaxle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 3:46 pm

Depends on the engine. There are some that will scatter just above the stock power level...and there are some that can come close to doubling the factory power with no ill effects. (Offhand, a Buick Grand National could manage 425HP-stock was 245-on stock internals without a problem.)

And do you think the people who would try for a 300HP street bike would care about longevity?

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:19 pm

Jarlaxle wrote:
And do you think the people who would try for a 300HP street bike would care about longevity?
No they would not, but that was not my point at all. My point is that you simply cannot take a 200 HP engine and turn it into a 300 HP engine by plugging it into a laptop as another poster asserted. The difference between the race ECU and the stock ECU for Ducatis for example is virtually nil in terms of HP. It simply smoothes out the bike originally mapped to satisfy the stringent EPA standards. On my Hypermotard, even if you add the ECU, cam, full exhaust, intake; big bore kit with high compression piston and bump in displacement, you would be lucky to see 30 HP increase....and you probably spent about $5,000 in parts alone.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Jarlaxle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:27 pm

You are STILL not understanding: your Ducati HAS NO BOOST TO TURN UP! That is the key!

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:33 pm

Jarlaxle wrote:You are STILL not understanding: your Ducati HAS NO BOOST TO TURN UP! That is the key!
I understand that. But do you really think the difference between the engine/trans of a $70,000 (my guesstimate) racebike and the $20,000 (my guesstimate) street verssion of it is going to be just boost??? :boat:
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:40 pm

Jarlaxle wrote:Buick Grand National
Not to derail the thread but that GN/GNX engine was a great engine; probably the only good one GM made back then. It's hard to imagine that the same company that thought making a diesel engine out of low compression 350 Olds gas engines was a good idea, created that motor during the same era.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Jarlaxle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:45 pm

Probably not...but how many of the hard-part changes will affect POWER (milder cam, lower compression), how many would just be for emissions (muffler, catalyst), and how many would be only for durability (sodium-filled valves, thicker piston tops)?

I know motorcycle engines are much higher-strung than cars, but if you have never owned a turbo car, you cannot understand just how easy it is to make huge power. (There is at least one nut in Missouri putting down over 1000HP from a 2800cc 4-banger--a 2-valve 70's design no less--his Mustang will show taillights to many sportbikes at the drags!)

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Sun Oct 05, 2014 5:53 pm

Jarlaxle wrote:Probably not...but how many of the hard-part changes will affect POWER (milder cam, lower compression), how many would just be for emissions (muffler, catalyst), and how many would be only for durability (sodium-filled valves, thicker piston tops)?

I know motorcycle engines are much higher-strung than cars, but if you have never owned a turbo car, you cannot understand just how easy it is to make huge power. (There is at least one nut in Missouri putting down over 1000HP from a 2800cc 4-banger--a 2-valve 70's design no less--his Mustang will show taillights to many sportbikes at the drags!)
Increasing boost on a supercharger is nowhere as easy as it is on a turbo as you well know; and even more difficult on a motorcycle due to size constraints and limitations.
You increase boost, you are gonna have to do the other stuff. Not arguing that it cannot be done, but it will take bucks, time, engineering, and skills. Nothing like the science fiction of plugging it into a laptop, and voila instant 100 HP.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Jarlaxle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 6:07 pm

Not as much as you think...you do need to turn up the fuel in proportion to the boost, which is quite simple (easiest way is to bump fuel pressure). It may not be perfectly optimized...but it will make power!

How is the blower driven?

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by totalmotorcycle » Sun Oct 05, 2014 7:29 pm

Well, they did try turbo's in the 80s with mixed success from Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki (and some 3rd parties messing with Kawasaki). In the end, a 500-650cc turbo bike did perform like a 1000cc bike, but in the end, the complexity and cost it was just easier to sell the rider a 1000cc bike.

Even then, strapping a turbo to a 650cc bike didn't net you x2 the power. The Seca 650R Turbo was a great example (and I owned the non-turbo one), I had around 72hp, the turbo version pumped out an amazing 90hp with approximately 7 psi stock to about 12 psi as modified.

So if you use those numbers, that's a 25% HP gain with a turbo. So if we took the new 2015 Kawasaki ZX-10R (188hp with ram air), then we would end up with a 235hp bike with 7-12psi boost). 235hp would be the highest HP of any production bike, but far from 300hp.

The flight for more HP = more and more money. Easy hp is cheap (exhaust or air filter) but gets more and more expensive the more you try to find (port and polishing, bore job, etc).





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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Flipper » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:08 pm

I love any bike that helps me self actualize my Batcycle fantasy.
This one does.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by Grey Thumper » Tue Oct 07, 2014 9:15 pm

All those carbonfibre winglets look badass (and add to the batcycle look), but do look like a lot of expensive bits that'll snap off in even a minor shunt or drop.
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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by BRUMBEAR » Wed Oct 08, 2014 5:56 am

with that machine there will be no minor drops off idle you can make 60mph :mrgreen:
there aint nothin like it

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by ZRex » Wed Oct 08, 2014 12:43 pm

Awesome, if there were a higher vote I would put that. I don't think a lot of people on here understand that this is not a street bike, there won't be kids riding it through traffic, plus it will be extremely expensive. I don't know how strong those winglets are, but they are carbon fiber not plastic and carbon fiber is something like 5 times stronger than steel.

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by montanalifter » Thu Oct 09, 2014 11:24 am

Love it, but really how many people with own the race version? I think it will be very interesting to see the price and specs. of the street version.

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by totalmotorcycle » Thu Oct 09, 2014 1:17 pm

I'm wondering what Kawasaki is going to use this bike for, I'm sure it doesn't meet MotoGP guidelines, so even though it's a track bike, it's not a race bike (unless they start their own division). Would it start a horsepower war? Sure. But I'm not sure how much more is really needed. Power to weight ratio is already silly and silly+ isn't going to change a lot.

Now for a street version, I know very few professional riders that could master 200hp, let alone 300hp. A 225hp street bike with a super charger makes headlines for sure, but how rideable is it? Great for a straight line if you can hang on, but pure horsepower doesn't equal more fun, after all, horsepower = top speed. Torque = acceleration (generally). Sure, the bike will blow past 300kh/h, maybe even 350km/h, but there are very few places in the world you can legally use it.

For the cool factor, it's very cool. You have a supercharger on a bike! Wowzers. For a bike though... hmmm, many will just shake their heads at the stupidity of it all.

Whatever the reason Kawasaki has built these, I fail to see (other than a superficial reason that is).

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by ceemes » Thu Oct 09, 2014 7:43 pm

totalmotorcycle wrote:I'm wondering what Kawasaki is going to use this bike for, I'm sure it doesn't meet MotoGP guidelines, so even though it's a track bike, it's not a race bike (unless they start their own division). Would it start a horsepower war? Sure. But I'm not sure how much more is really needed. Power to weight ratio is already silly and silly+ isn't going to change a lot.

Now for a street version, I know very few professional riders that could master 200hp, let alone 300hp. A 225hp street bike with a super charger makes headlines for sure, but how rideable is it? Great for a straight line if you can hang on, but pure horsepower doesn't equal more fun, after all, horsepower = top speed. Torque = acceleration (generally). Sure, the bike will blow past 300kh/h, maybe even 350km/h, but there are very few places in the world you can legally use it.

For the cool factor, it's very cool. You have a supercharger on a bike! Wowzers. For a bike though... hmmm, many will just shake their heads at the stupidity of it all.

Whatever the reason Kawasaki has built these, I fail to see (other than a superficial reason that is).

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by totalmotorcycle » Thu Oct 09, 2014 8:37 pm

ceemes wrote:
totalmotorcycle wrote:Whatever the reason Kawasaki has built these, I fail to see (other than a superficial reason that is).

Mike
Stupidity doesn't even begin to cover the foolishness of this bike.
Oh, we are in the same boat. I guess it all depends on how Kawasaki markets it and who their market is. Right now it's racers, which is fine with me as they don't let you on the track without full gear to crash in and it's harder to injure yourself vs the street.

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Re: This Week: 2015 Kawasaki Ninja H2R Supercharged - Vote N

Unread post by HYPERR » Thu Oct 09, 2014 10:26 pm

totalmotorcycle wrote:horsepower = top speed. Torque = acceleration (generally)
Actually engine horsepower is much more relevant to acceleration than engine torque.
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