Newbie question - downshifting & turns

[jstark47]

When you guys take a turn, you don't ride the clutch until the apex huh?

No.

What if you were just in la la land and didn't realize what gear you were in and didn't know whether or not to downshift or upshift and you were about to hit a curve that has a decreasing radius beyond the apex. Do you ride the clutch or downshift or upshift even if you don't know what gear you're in?

You don't need to know what gear you're in. Slow the bike to the appropriate entry speed before you enter the curve. Downshifting can help slow the bike. Downshifting also appropriately positions you to apply power exiting the curve, particularly if you were on the low side of the RPM range in the higher gear when you began slowing down. You can tell this by sound -- my bike e.g. has no tachometer.

Do you give it a lil maintenance throttle and lean harder or give it acceleration and lean harder?

This is a difference of degree, not of kind. It depends on the curve. If it's a really nasty decreasing radius I'm not going to accelerate hard out of it, particularly if I can't see all the way around it...... which means I don't actually know where the apex is. As a newbie, your objective is to get around the curve, not to emulate Matt Mladin.

[flynrider]

However, now that I am on my own I find myself a bit more uneasy taking these turns out on roads than I was in a parking lot with cones at the safety course.

This is one of the tougher things to learn when you first start out. For most 90 degree turns onto a side street, it might make it easier if you're in 2nd gear. 1st gear is primarily for starting from a dead stop and throttle control can be somewhat jerky going around a corner. I think you'll find that second gear will allow you to make a much smoother turn.

Oh yeah, that "friend' that told you not to use the clutch when downshifting? Don't listen to him anymore. Just the sound of the poor tranny trying to clank into a lower gear without the clutch should make it clear that it's not a good idea. In your example (i.e. slowing for a 90 degree corner), it could be downright dangerous.

[Trakanon]

Lots of great information guys. Thank you very much for the tips. I will definatly do some exercises tonight in a parking lot and put them to use.

-Trak

[Shorts]

This is one of the tougher things to learn when you first start out. For most 90 degree turns onto a side street, it might make it easier if you're in 2nd gear. 1st gear is primarily for starting from a dead stop and throttle control can be somewhat jerky going around a corner. I think you'll find that second gear will allow you to make a much smoother turn.

You made something in my brain click. I've noticed during practice of turns in 1st gear feels jerky. Makes me a bit nervous trying to learn the feel of pushing/pulling as I'm trying to hold the throttle steady so it doesn't bounce through curve...that's unnerving. Why haven't I learned to shift to 2nd yet??


Sorry for the hijack, just replaying my last time out wondering about things

[jstark47]

You made something in my brain click. I've noticed during practice of turns in 1st gear feels jerky. Makes me a bit nervous trying to learn the feel of pushing/pulling as I'm trying to hold the throttle steady so it doesn't bounce through curve...that's unnerving. Why haven't I learned to shift to 2nd yet??

2nd is smoother, and most bikes have enough torque to pull in 2nd gear from almost 0 mph. For even more control, feather the clutch a little, and the highest level of the technique also includes a little rear brake pressure. This is how the motor officers push those big patrol bikes around pylons under 5 mph in their training exercises.

Don't know how well feathering the clutch and simulaneous fine throttle adjustment is going to work for you one-handed, though. I find it plenty challenging with 2 hands.

[Shorts]

2nd is smoother, and most bikes have enough torque to pull in 2nd gear from almost 0 mph. For even more control, feather the clutch a little, and the highest level of the technique also includes a little rear brake pressure. This is how the motor officers push those big patrol bikes around pylons under 5 mph in their training exercises.

Don't know how well feathering the clutch and simulaneous fine throttle adjustment is going to work for you one-handed, though. I find it plenty challenging with 2 hands.

I imagine after getting comfortable using throttle only I'll be able to work on feathering the clutch. At this stage I'm still thinking a lot about basic manuevers, so no fancy things just yet. Frankly, even thinking about feathering the clutch in a turn scares me

[ofblong]

You made something in my brain click. I've noticed during practice of turns in 1st gear feels jerky. Makes me a bit nervous trying to learn the feel of pushing/pulling as I'm trying to hold the throttle steady so it doesn't bounce through curve...that's unnerving. Why haven't I learned to shift to 2nd yet??

2nd is smoother, and most bikes have enough torque to pull in 2nd gear from almost 0 mph. For even more control, feather the clutch a little, and the highest level of the technique also includes a little rear brake pressure. This is how the motor officers push those big patrol bikes around pylons under 5 mph in their training exercises.

Don't know how well feathering the clutch and simulaneous fine throttle adjustment is going to work for you one-handed, though. I find it plenty challenging with 2 hands.

my bike almost hesitates when in second going from 0-go speed but it does go lol. I figured that out when I noticed the neutral light didnt come on when I upshifted lol.

[Trakanon]

As a follow-up, when taking these 90 degree turns in second, am I using a slight amount of throttle or am I using friction zone to power myself through the turn?

[ofblong]

As a follow-up, when taking these 90 degree turns in second, am I using a slight amount of throttle or am I using friction zone to power myself through the turn?

umm I dont use the clutch at all. I keep it covered in case I need it (like i have to make an immediate stop) but I dont use it. I just use the throttle like I learned in the MSF course.

[jstark47]

I imagine after getting comfortable using throttle only I'll be able to work on feathering the clutch. At this stage I'm still thinking a lot about basic manuevers, so no fancy things just yet. Frankly, even thinking about feathering the clutch in a turn scares me

You're gonna have to get through the figure 8 in a box in the MSF course -- you're taking that, right? I can't remember what you're riding or how torquey it is down low. Assuming it has decent low end torque, suggest this: before you take the MSF (they're letting you use your bike, right?) adjust the idle speed down a bit. You want to do the figure 8 in 2nd gear, it's so much smoother. But you don't want to go too fast, and feathering the clutch, which is the usual speed control in this situation, is iffy for you. If the bike's got the grunt, get that idle down so it will just barely pull the bike in 2nd without stalling. That's how you'll get around the figure 8 maneuver.

You can do this. It's do-able. But you're gonna have to practice more than the average rider.....