Ducati 695 Monster for a beginner??

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High_Side · Tue Apr 17, 2007 4:44 pm

Having an Monster S2R 800 in the garage I would have to say that the 695 would be an excellent choice for a new rider. The smaller Monsters are some of the most forgiving, neutral handling bikes that you can buy. The 695 is better than the 800 for newbs due to the lower seat height as well. The chassis is also very solid providing far greater stability over uneven pavement than smaller "beginner" bikes. Having ridden an SV650 on the weekend I would rate the output quite similar to the 800 Monster. Despite what Ducati publishes I suspect that there is more difference than the 4 h.p. difference betweent he 695 and 800 as well.

spin wrote:i respectfully disagree with your assessement of both mine and the OP's comments. i apologize if this is a broken record to you but i think you arent reading what we are saying and just replying with generic opinions.

Agreed.

RideYourRide · Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:04 pm

High_Side wrote:
spin wrote:i respectfully disagree with your assessement of both mine and the OP's comments. i apologize if this is a broken record to you but i think you arent reading what we are saying and just replying with generic opinions.
Agreed.

My problem is that I don't (well, didn't) know anything about this guy. If he has been commuting to his urban job in an automatic Geo Metro for his entire adult life a 695 is gonna blow his mind. If his winter ride is a Polars Pro-X 800, he's going to think it's dragging an anchor.

I thought the Ninja 650r was very mild mannered when I rode one last weekend. I get on here the next day and there's a thread by someone who is scared to death of his. Perceptions vary. Until you provide the peanut gallery with real information it's not surprising that you'll get generic responses.

I'd love to see more required information for posting here.

Shorts · #23 Unread post by **Shorts** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:48 pm

spin wrote: ok. not sure what the difference is between me and the OP.
the 695 is a little bigger than my bike but we are with the same point of view.

New rider or not. Remember you said "I don't see where I said I was a new rider"? I was understanding (incorrectly) that the OP was a total newbie that said he just bought a new Monster, then asked if it was an ok beginner bike.

My posts still stand. I think I'm fairly athletic too, but I screw the controls sometimes.

#24 Unread post by **Koss** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:40 pm

Strength is absolutely useless for riding a motorcycle... except for pulling in a clutch on some bikes

If you muscle a bike and "throw your weight around" with a motorcycle... you'll find it will throw you to the ground faster than anything you have experienced. Motorcycles are about finesse and smooth controls. A motorcyle will even reward the rider more if they use extremely smooth and well placed movements, at the right times. And the right fashion. Know what the single most important thing is when it comes to riding a motorcycle? Rider Skill.

Maturity can help you out, if you are not planning to do something stupid. But if you don't have the skills, experience, or motorcycle knowledge that tells you what you are about to do by accident or ingorance... you wouldn't know it was stupid until you find out the hard way. Dosn't matter how much maturity you have if you target fixate or freeze or freak out or accidently pop a wheelie, or over brake and skid of the road. The bike will do what it is instructed to do, whether the rider knows what inputs he is giving or not!

With all that said... ya know, the 675 isn't HORRIBLY bad... there are better choices out there for sure. The power, weight, and power to weight ration would put it along with other "grey" area motorcycles. Alright for a first time rider, better as a second bike. You gotta be smarter, study more, and practice more... on a grey area bike than a true newbie friendly bike.

ofblong · #25 Unread post by **ofblong** » Tue Apr 17, 2007 8:06 pm

mmm Ducatiii whens someone gonna buy me the MS 1100?

jstark47 · Tue Apr 17, 2007 11:59 pm

spin wrote:I respectfully disagree with your assessement of both mine and the OP's comments. i apologize if this is a broken record to you but i think you arent reading what we are saying and just replying with generic opinions.

Disagreement is cool. That's why we have a forum! I did read and re-read both your's and Chris' posts before I responded. I respect your sincerity, and hope that you're with us for years to come. I want you to succeed, and to have fun doing it.

spin wrote:1) maturity - we understand we are riding big bikes and will proceed with caution

Caution has nothing to do with it. In a risky or marginal situation requiring nuanced control inputs, by the time the higher order brain processes can exercise caution, the situation is already decided.

spin wrote:2) athleticism - we are strong enough to PHYSICALLY handle a bigger bike

Strength is COMPLETELY irrelevant. Highly nuanced fine motor control is relevant.

spin wrote:3) when do we infer we will not 'practice'

You didn't, and I didn't state that you did. Careful reading, y'know......

spin wrote:4)when do we say we dont need skills because we are athletic or mature??

The emphasis is out of order. Athleticism is irrelvant, why even bring it up? Maturity is only indirectly relevant. Kinesthetic skills driven by trained mental reactions are paramount.

Please note: I'm not responding to your and Chris' choices of Ducatis. Ducs are cool, and Monsters are probably do-able as starter bikes, if a tad borderline. I'm responding to your assertion that athleticism and maturity are traits relevant for a beginning motorcyclist to succeed. My "broken record" analogy is harsh and I probably shouldn't have used it, but issue comes up repeatedly (constantly?) in discussions with folks joining the motorcycling community.

jstark47 · Wed Apr 18, 2007 12:01 am

Koss wrote:Maturity can help you out, if you are not planning to do something stupid. But if you don't have the skills, experience, or motorcycle knowledge that tells you what you are about to do by accident or ingorance... you wouldn't know it was stupid until you find out the hard way. Dosn't matter how much maturity you have if you target fixate or freeze or freak out or accidently pop a wheelie, or over brake and skid of the road. The bike will do what it is instructed to do, whether the rider knows what inputs he is giving or not!

+1 As usual, Koss states it more eloquently and with fewer words than me!!

spin · #28 Unread post by **spin** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 12:05 am

perhaps i shouldve added "coordinated" with athletic.

that said, i do understand the posts and thank you for all of them.
they will make me a better, safer, happier rider for sure and at the end of the day that is all what we are after.

Shorts · #29 Unread post by **Shorts** » Wed Apr 18, 2007 12:15 am

spin wrote:perhaps i shouldve added "coordinated" with athletic.

that said, i do understand the posts and thank you for all of them.
they will make me a better, safer, happier rider for sure and at the end of the day that is all what we are after.

Ok, I'm going to toot my own horn here (please forgive I will not do it again).

Spin, please read my blog

High_Side · Wed Apr 18, 2007 1:14 am

Going against the grain yet again:

Strength and physical size ARE important when determining what starter bike to buy. A 200+ # taller guy on a 250cc starter bike is not a smart option. You are physically too big for many of the starter bikes and it is better to have something sized to handle your size. The ability to manouver a bike in a parking lot without being intimidated by it is also determined by your physical size and strength.

Maturity counts for a lot when it comes to handling more power as well (not that the 695 is by any mean difficult to control). There is nothing about a 695 that will cause it to step-out from underneath you with an unexperienced twist of the wrist. You have to be determined to make it go fast. Even a 500 Ninja will do 120 mph if you twist your wrist for long enough.

RideYourRide wrote: My problem is that I don't (well, didn't) know anything about this guy. If he has been commuting to his urban job in an automatic Geo Metro for his entire adult life a 695 is gonna blow his mind. If his winter ride is a Polars Pro-X 800, he's going to think it's dragging an anchor.

I thought the Ninja 650r was very mild mannered when I rode one last weekend. I get on here the next day and there's a thread by someone who is scared to death of his. Perceptions vary. Until you provide the peanut gallery with real information it's not surprising that you'll get generic responses.

I'd love to see more required information for posting here.

My comment of "agreed" in my previous post was based on some of the responses that made big assumptions. I rarely post up in the New Bikers forum but when I stop in occasionally I find the atmosphere almost hostile to newbs asking simple questions. The "generic resposes" quote hit a note with me as well with the "your going to kill yourself" automatic responses that happen without knowing all of the information.

I would also like to open up the debate on what makes a great starter bike once again but in a different thread. A Monster 620 / 695 is the perfect starter bike for many new riders but doesn't fit inside the accepted "box" for many here on TMW. Many of those people haven't even ridden one.....

Is there anyone I haven't pissed off with this post???