A New Rider But an Old Friend

[Ryethil]

I need some advice and/or other people's thoughts to get me through this.

I've not been shy but I've had a partner for more than 6 years and we hope that it lasts at least a hundred years more...

Now today she tells me that she wants to learn to ride.

Okay, I can deal to a point. But she says she's been thinking a lot about this and has gotten a lot of support from the Gurls in our club. I can't see her as a patch wearer but everyone's taken to her quest and and even the guys are giving her pointers. Not to put too fine a point on it but these are guys who think women are to be used. But they've been talking to her behind my back and think it is a great thing. As a side bar, I'm dealing with some anger issues because this was done without my knowledge or okay but that not for this thread.

She is a nurse in an ER and she's her share of "ugly" stories and has profesed to be frighten by motorcycle riding and especially of me riding. We've bought her full armor but she doen't like to ride as co-pilot on the back of one of my Harleys, even the Street Glide we got just for that purpose. However, she feels safer on the back of the ST and rides more often.

Anyway, she has ridden dirt bikes at the farm but shown no interest in learning to ride on the street. Now she says she has been thinking about if for a while. She's also be really chummy with the Gurls in our club and they have gone so far as let her take rides on their bikes. They are about half Sportsters and half Big Twins, mostly Street Bobs and Low Riders but a few of everything else. How I would handle her as a fellow patch member is not for this thread either.

So now I'm stuck on what to do. I've already made sure that she takes the MSF course and called the director and signed her up for the next available classes. I can teach her a lot myself but I would rather her get the basics from them. However, if she doesn't get what's she wants from the classes, I know she'll either pester me or let the Gurls teach her.

Now there is a further plot device, She doesn't want a learner bike as such. she's gotten a tast of a Sportster and while it's a bit scary, she feel that is what she wants. She 5'7" 32" inseam. She ridden some of the other Gurl's Sportsters and they all ride 1200s mostly Customs. We went to the dealer today to look at the Iron XL883N and she liked it but wondered aloud if it would keep up with a 1200. I've got a Nightster at the farm as part of a trade I made. So of course she wanted to ride it today. After I got it fueled and the fluids changed, she used a dirt bike helmet and tried riding around the paddock a bit. It was a bit much for her to handle but she's dedicated. She surprised me as she didn't stall as much as I thought she would. So she's a bit more experienced than I expected.

So what do I do?

She's not a rank beginner, she's ridden in the dirt for a few years. She's not totally unsensical about this but she's really been influenced by the people around me and wants to be as forthright as they are. I don't want to rein her in roughly and I'm not sure that I could anyway. My friends may have broken what control of her that I had especially over this.

I'm the fartherest thing from the idiot that decided his GF needed to learn on a Sportster but she is really pressing on her own. Am I worrying too much? She really level headed for most things. She usually the smarter of the two of us but now I'm not so sure. Tonight when we got home she put on a mesh jacket she had gotten from somewhere and a half helmet that belongs to one particular Gurl who has it as a spare. So already I've got to unlearn her from some the bad habits the other Gurls have taught her.

Ah, h*ll, I could go on for hours but it wouldn't do any good. Just send me what you think and I deal with it the best I can.

Thanks for listening and thank you to those that send in ideas.

[Brackstone]

I don't know enough about Harley's to tell you what bikes are good and are not.

But I personally would not hang out with people that would look at women as objects to begin with, because they don't give good advice, especially to women.

[Ryethil]

I don't know enough about Harley's to tell you what bikes are good and are not.

But I personally would not hang out with people that would look at women as objects to begin with, because they don't give good advice, especially to women.

Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I didn't think things through when I wrote the post...

A large part of my world is those that "DO" and those that don't or want to be led. I can see that the way I explained certain things will leave most people scratching their heads. The guys are the way they are because they are strong enough that few people tell them "no". However, they aren't really the terrible people. They try to be law abiding citizens though they're always a bit on the edge. There not 1%ers but they can be a bit scruffy. They have an attitude towards women that can be rather neanderthal but women flock to them so who am I to say that they're wrong. They respect the police though there is always a bit of tension when the two meet. They all have jobs, afford expensive motorcycles though people like me provide them with bargains and they actually seldom get into any legal trouble except maybe drunk and disorderly. We gurls are similar and we've shown people that we're not to be taken lightly. We can't really use brute force but we've been very political in certain groups and some very powerful clubs owe us and protect us from anyone who would take advantage of us. So we have a tendency to live out on the edge ourselves.

I only mentioned it becaue there is a code of conduct that protects everyone and it is followed closely or anarchy can reign. In my case there were some breaches of the code and I've accepted to just go with the flow but it will be diffrent in the future.

But this has little to do with my problem because it is someone that I care about and want the best for. And need other person's input to help me make up my mind how I'm going to handle this.

Sorry, just a note from the other side...

[CYNWAGON]

If she was a spineless, and not the strong, smart woman she sound like - would you be with her?

Did she maybe do things a little sideways in the beginning by going to other people instead of you? - Possibly.

She has now shared her intent with you and IMHO I think you should grab this opportunity by the horns and enjoy the ride. The MSF course is a must, after that see what happens, she may decide the Sportster's not for her, she may not - her choice. Just help her make smart decisions.

[Brackstone]

Thanks for the extra context.

I have to agree with Cyn in a way, she seems to have made up her mind. I've known stubborn women, for some reason I always end up dating them too, maybe because I'm really easy going? (Not saying your woman is always stubborn just bringing in some context as to why I'm qualified to answer this)

Anyway, the side-stepping, the laser lock on the sportster, etc. I've found with someone who is being stubborn it's best to leave it alone and then wait for a moment like this.

She says "You know, I don't know what I would do without you." or something similar.
You reply "I know, I feel the same way, and while I respect your deceision to buy the bike you want, I'm afraid of you hurting yourself because if anything happened to you I would be very upset. I won't bring it up again because I know your heart is set, but I hope you understand why I am scared"

Then WAIT for her to say something. If you keep talking and talking it'll just grate on her.

Right there you'll get the true response, if she has the slightest bit of hesitation but is afraid to admit it because of pride, stubbornness, or whatever it will come out. If she says "Thanks, I'm glad you're okay with it" well there's nothing you can do unfortunately.

[MTexile]

I'll throw in my $.02...I learned to ride in college back in the late 80's from a buddy who had a Yamaha 350 or 450. For a 6 pack he'd let me take it out on weekend afternoons. Drove around campus in the summer when traffic was light and no cops around (no license). Fast forward to 2002, a buddy came back from Afghanistan and bought a BMW Dakar and invited me to ride on the back. After 10 minutes, got the fever again, took the MSF and bought a '03 1200 Sportster.
It sounds like her mind is made up, with her dirt bike experience it sounds like she has a good start on riding skills. Regarding experience, you know her, I don't. In my case, I made a few mistakes the first few months (stalling, braking/steering too hard/soft, etc.) and dropping mine twice. Is she physically capable of lifting 500 lbs? From personal experience I know nurses have to be strong, but we are talking about her having to lift a motorcycle by herself if necessary.
Finally the 883/1200 question. Another Army buddy took the MSF course about the same time I did and got a 883 Low (his first bike). He had no problem keeping up with us, but we rarely went above 70 mph on the interstate. If I were you, let her learn on the Nightster for now, after she passes the MSF course, find a HD dealer that will let her take a demo ride on a 1200. HD is hurting for sales so they might let her do it.
Sounds like her mind is made up, I'd support her 100% At least you will be able to influence her decision-making, good luck!

[MZ33]

because it is someone that I care about and want the best for

Now you know how she feels. She has had to watch you do your bike thing for some time now. It is a different thing entirely for me to ride than to watch my husband ride. I find I am a little anxious for him. The risk is real. I don't want to risk him, but I also don't want to swaddle him in bubble wrap and set him on the mantlepiece. We do what we can to be responsible and to minimize our risks, but we each have to deal with our fear of loss. That is true with many things, but getting struck by lightning or shot in the street is much more theoretical than getting injured or killed motorcycling. It's kind of like being married to a cop or a firefighter, though not as constant. Now, your partner is ready to try her own wings. Time for you to reach down into your gut and support her, despite your fears, as she has done for you. It is, I admit, easier said than done.

As to how she went about it, well, that may be for a variety of reasons, but what leaps out at me, quite frankly, is control issues. You are struggling with her decision and how she is going about it, and you yourself are a strong personality. You sound like you are willing for her to be your pillion, but not to be her own pilot. (Personally, I would always want my partner able to handle the bike, in case he/she needed to go for help.) Is it really a mystery as to why she might have chosen to do her exploring of the issue without your knowledge? As far as the men & women she has consulted with, they ride with you, to some degree that could be seen as an endorsement by you. She didn't go consulting wheelie-popping squids. She consulted your people. If I had a friend who wanted to explore the idea of riding, but didn't want her parents/sig other/older brother to know about it, and she was an adult, I sure wouldn't rat her out. I'd support her in ways that I thought were safe and responsible. Yes, I would wonder why she can't trust the other person in the relationship enough to be upfront about it, but that, as you indicated, is a different issue.

[jaskc78]

FOREWARNING--I'm not pulling any punches on this one, so Ryethil, if you don't want to be at the very least seriously questioned and more likely offended, don't read this. Send me a PM and I'll remove it. Scroll down further to read.
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I need some advice and/or other people's thoughts to get me through this.

I've not been shy but I've had a partner for more than 6 years and we hope that it lasts at least a hundred years more...

Now today she tells me that she wants to learn to ride.

Okay, I can deal to a point. But she says she's been thinking a lot about this and has gotten a lot of support from the Gurls in our club. I can't see her as a patch wearer but everyone's taken to her quest and and even the guys are giving her pointers. Not to put too fine a point on it but these are guys who think women are to be used. But they've been talking to her behind my back and think it is a great thing. As a side bar, I'm dealing with some anger issues because this was done without my knowledge or okay but that not for this thread.

She is a nurse in an ER and she's her share of "ugly" stories and has profesed to be frighten by motorcycle riding and especially of me riding. We've bought her full armor but she doen't like to ride as co-pilot on the back of one of my Harleys, even the Street Glide we got just for that purpose. However, she feels safer on the back of the ST and rides more often.

Anyway, she has ridden dirt bikes at the farm but shown no interest in learning to ride on the street. Now she says she has been thinking about if for a while. She's also be really chummy with the Gurls in our club and they have gone so far as let her take rides on their bikes. They are about half Sportsters and half Big Twins, mostly Street Bobs and Low Riders but a few of everything else. How I would handle her as a fellow patch member is not for this thread either.

So now I'm stuck on what to do. I've already made sure that she takes the MSF course and called the director and signed her up for the next available classes. I can teach her a lot myself but I would rather her get the basics from them. However, if she doesn't get what's she wants from the classes, I know she'll either pester me or let the Gurls teach her.

Now there is a further plot device, She doesn't want a learner bike as such. she's gotten a tast of a Sportster and while it's a bit scary, she feel that is what she wants. She 5'7" 32" inseam. She ridden some of the other Gurl's Sportsters and they all ride 1200s mostly Customs. We went to the dealer today to look at the Iron XL883N and she liked it but wondered aloud if it would keep up with a 1200. I've got a Nightster at the farm as part of a trade I made. So of course she wanted to ride it today. After I got it fueled and the fluids changed, she used a dirt bike helmet and tried riding around the paddock a bit. It was a bit much for her to handle but she's dedicated. She surprised me as she didn't stall as much as I thought she would. So she's a bit more experienced than I expected.

So what do I do?

She's not a rank beginner, she's ridden in the dirt for a few years. She's not totally unsensical about this but she's really been influenced by the people around me and wants to be as forthright as they are. I don't want to rein her in roughly and I'm not sure that I could anyway. My friends may have broken what control of her that I had especially over this.

I'm the fartherest thing from the idiot that decided his GF needed to learn on a Sportster but she is really pressing on her own. Am I worrying too much? She really level headed for most things. She usually the smarter of the two of us but now I'm not so sure. Tonight when we got home she put on a mesh jacket she had gotten from somewhere and a half helmet that belongs to one particular Gurl who has it as a spare. So already I've got to unlearn her from some the bad habits the other Gurls have taught her.

Ah, h*ll, I could go on for hours but it wouldn't do any good. Just send me what you think and I deal with it the best I can.

Thanks for listening and thank you to those that send in ideas.

Judging by the way this started "partner for a hundred more years" I'd assume you two are very happy together...then I read "anger issues because it was done without my knowledge or okay" and "My friends may have broken what control of her that I had especially over this."

Really? Let's start with that. You're so happy with your relationship that you're worried you'll lose the control you have over your partner. Read that out loud to yourself...a few times. Let me know when it actually makes sense in your own ears, because it sure as hell doesn't in mine.

"Okay, I can deal to a point. But she says she's been thinking a lot about this and has gotten a lot of support from the Gurls in our club. I can't see her as a patch wearer but everyone's taken to her quest and and even the guys are giving her pointers. Not to put too fine a point on it but these are guys who think women are to be used. But they've been talking to her behind my back and think it is a great thing."

Point numero dos: You can deal to a POINT? YOU can deal to a POINT? Why is it that you have to deal with any of it? Don't you remember that thing called FREEDOM that you were all about the other day in your posts? Don't talk the talk if you aren't going to walk the walk. She's her own person and at least she's including you in her decision--that she even made by herself.

Numero Tres: Girl is spelled with an I, not a U. Moving on. She didn't say anything about being a "patch wearer," did she? Let's deal with what she's actually wanting to do, not the possibility that sometime later she'll be wanting to invade Turkey or something. And honestly, maybe she talked to them because she knew your reaction would be like this. You're here asking a bunch of people whom you've never met to give you relationship advice on someone you've been with for 6 years and you're talking about control and she talked to people behind your back. She talked to other riders about riding motorcycles. And for all these guys that think women are objects, wouldn't they try to keep her "in her place" on the back of a cycle instead of not only encouraging her to learn to ride but helping her learn to ride?

Point D: She's a nurse in the ER and blah blah blah. None of that bothered you when she was watching you zoom away on your motorcycle, but now that she wants to it's suddenly bad for her? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If you can't accept her risk-taking, perhaps you should reconsider your asking her to accept your risk-taking.

Point 5: She's ridden before, and most every rider I've talked to says that having dirtbike experience is a GREAT help with street riding. It teaches you better control at low speeds and tight turns, etc. You should be happy about this, she won't suck as much as many of us (probably even you) did at one point or possibly still do depending on experience.

6: "Chummy with the GIRLS in our club...." So you're a group of high-schoolers or are you all women. Seriously, stop being so degrading to the fairer sex. "They have let her take rides on their bikes." She's got friends? HOW DARE SHE?! I demand an immediate bra burning!!! Do you see how what you said seems a little silly in that context? So she's got friends that she talked to about riding. Whoop-dee-doo.

Siete: Patch wearer thing again. Let it go, you're not the boss of her no matter if you have a patch or not. If you keep holding onto this supposed control as desperately as it appears you are, don't you think she'll catch on sooner or later that maybe you don't much care what she wants, only what you want for her or want her to do? As much as you play the gender card and as often as I hear you mention how you get treated so unfairly because you got tatas and a woohoo, I'd expected a lot more understanding and acceptance. Maybe she didn't, though, and that's why she's been talking to other people instead of you. Just a thought.

The Ocho: Signed her up for an MSF course? That's probably the best thing in your entire post. Might even be the only good thing, but I'm guessing you were a bit upset at the time of posting and maybe that tainted how you wrote. Just a guess, though.

Ocho plus 1: An 883 sportster? That can't be that bad of a starter bike. It isn't ideal, but if she's already got some experience (more than you expected, even), then she'd probably be ok. At least she doesn't want to ride around town on some damn appliance, right?

10: What do you do? She's been influenced by the people around you? You don't want to riegn her in roughly? Well, the answer to the first lies with the responses to the second and third. It really sounds like you want to reign her in, you just want to be nice about it. Maybe you could actually convince her that staying barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen was her idea; that'd be perfect, right? And if the people around you are such a negative influence on her, how are they not a bad influence on you? Or is it just that they're filling her head with all those silly notions about doing what she wants to do, pursuing her interests, and being safe all the while? If they're bad people, why are you around them and why did you drag her into it?

11: Farth(er)est thing from the idiot blah blah blah. Really? You sound pretty idiotic to me, at least. She's really pressing on her own.... Almost like this freedom thing I heard about somewhere. Almost, but not quite. Also, the answer is yes, you're worrying too much. About her being the smarter of the two, what has changed so dramatically that suddenly she went stupid? She wants to learn to ride motorcycles? Is that dumb? If you admit that she's really level-headed and has shown good judgment in the past, maybe you could/should trust her judgment this time, too? As far as the mesh jacket and half-helmet, weren't you the person on here asking about which gear isn't really needed because it's hot? I'm assuming the jacket has some armor in it and the helmet is DOT-approved (both of which were suggestions you actually liked in your 'I'm too hot to wear gear' post), so it's not really all that bad. I bet the jacket even has sleeves! Maybe you can even get her to wear full-fingered gloves. Maybe you could even start wearing them yourself *GASP*.

In summation: If she wants to ride, help her the best you can. Make sure you set a good example to reinforce the positive habits and help her unlearn any negative habits she may pick up (no, I don't view mesh as a negative habit). Accept the fact that while she may not be wearing full biker gang leathers, she's wearing protection that has been proven to help absorb some of the impact in the event of an accident and help keep her skin on her body. Make sure she understands that Harley isn't the only motorcycle company on Earth, and you could even stop sneering at everything that isn't a Harley to maybe help convince her that a starter bike isn't a bad idea. You could also let her be what she wants to be instead of trying to make her be what you want to be. If you want Susie Homemaker, go find yourself a Susie Homemaker. If you want her, then stop bitching that you two may have something else in common shortly.

I'm not going to get into the nitty-gritty of relationship details and everything else that strikes me as horribly wrong in your post, but perhaps you should take a step back and reevaluate what it is you want in a relationship.

[blues2cruise]

FOREWARNING--I'm not pulling any punches on this one, so Ryethil, if you don't want to be at the very least seriously questioned and more likely offended, don't read this. Send me a PM and I'll remove it. Scroll down further to read.

Judging by the way this started "partner for a hundred more years" I'd assume you two are very happy together...then I read "anger issues because it was done without my knowledge or okay" and "My friends may have broken what control of her that I had especially over this."

Really? Let's start with that. You're so happy with your relationship that you're worried you'll lose the control you have over your partner. Read that out loud to yourself...a few times. Let me know when it actually makes sense in your own ears, because it sure as hell doesn't in mine.

"Okay, I can deal to a point. But she says she's been thinking a lot about this and has gotten a lot of support from the Gurls in our club. I can't see her as a patch wearer but everyone's taken to her quest and and even the guys are giving her pointers. Not to put too fine a point on it but these are guys who think women are to be used. But they've been talking to her behind my back and think it is a great thing."

Point numero dos: You can deal to a POINT? YOU can deal to a POINT? Why is it that you have to deal with any of it? Don't you remember that thing called FREEDOM that you were all about the other day in your posts? Don't talk the talk if you aren't going to walk the walk. She's her own person and at least she's including you in her decision--that she even made by herself.

Numero Tres: Girl is spelled with an I, not a U. Moving on. She didn't say anything about being a "patch wearer," did she? Let's deal with what she's actually wanting to do, not the possibility that sometime later she'll be wanting to invade Turkey or something. And honestly, maybe she talked to them because she knew your reaction would be like this. You're here asking a bunch of people whom you've never met to give you relationship advice on someone you've been with for 6 years and you're talking about control and she talked to people behind your back. She talked to other riders about riding motorcycles. And for all these guys that think women are objects, wouldn't they try to keep her "in her place" on the back of a cycle instead of not only encouraging her to learn to ride but helping her learn to ride?

Point D: She's a nurse in the ER and blah blah blah. None of that bothered you when she was watching you zoom away on your motorcycle, but now that she wants to it's suddenly bad for her? What's good for the goose is good for the gander. If you can't accept her risk-taking, perhaps you should reconsider your asking her to accept your risk-taking.

Point 5: She's ridden before, and most every rider I've talked to says that having dirtbike experience is a GREAT help with street riding. It teaches you better control at low speeds and tight turns, etc. You should be happy about this, she won't suck as much as many of us (probably even you) did at one point or possibly still do depending on experience.

6: "Chummy with the GIRLS in our club...." So you're a group of high-schoolers or are you all women. Seriously, stop being so degrading to the fairer sex. "They have let her take rides on their bikes." She's got friends? HOW DARE SHE?! I demand an immediate bra burning!!! Do you see how what you said seems a little silly in that context? So she's got friends that she talked to about riding. Whoop-dee-doo.

Siete: Patch wearer thing again. Let it go, you're not the boss of her no matter if you have a patch or not. If you keep holding onto this supposed control as desperately as it appears you are, don't you think she'll catch on sooner or later that maybe you don't much care what she wants, only what you want for her or want her to do? As much as you play the gender card and as often as I hear you mention how you get treated so unfairly because you got tatas and a woohoo, I'd expected a lot more understanding and acceptance. Maybe she didn't, though, and that's why she's been talking to other people instead of you. Just a thought.

The Ocho: Signed her up for an MSF course? That's probably the best thing in your entire post. Might even be the only good thing, but I'm guessing you were a bit upset at the time of posting and maybe that tainted how you wrote. Just a guess, though.

Ocho plus 1: An 883 sportster? That can't be that bad of a starter bike. It isn't ideal, but if she's already got some experience (more than you expected, even), then she'd probably be ok. At least she doesn't want to ride around town on some damn appliance, right?

10: What do you do? She's been influenced by the people around you? You don't want to riegn her in roughly? Well, the answer to the first lies with the responses to the second and third. It really sounds like you want to reign her in, you just want to be nice about it. Maybe you could actually convince her that staying barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen was her idea; that'd be perfect, right? And if the people around you are such a negative influence on her, how are they not a bad influence on you? Or is it just that they're filling her head with all those silly notions about doing what she wants to do, pursuing her interests, and being safe all the while? If they're bad people, why are you around them and why did you drag her into it?

11: Farth(er)est thing from the idiot blah blah blah. Really? You sound pretty idiotic to me, at least. She's really pressing on her own.... Almost like this freedom thing I heard about somewhere. Almost, but not quite. Also, the answer is yes, you're worrying too much. About her being the smarter of the two, what has changed so dramatically that suddenly she went stupid? She wants to learn to ride motorcycles? Is that dumb? If you admit that she's really level-headed and has shown good judgment in the past, maybe you could/should trust her judgment this time, too? As far as the mesh jacket and half-helmet, weren't you the person on here asking about which gear isn't really needed because it's hot? I'm assuming the jacket has some armor in it and the helmet is DOT-approved (both of which were suggestions you actually liked in your 'I'm too hot to wear gear' post), so it's not really all that bad. I bet the jacket even has sleeves! Maybe you can even get her to wear full-fingered gloves. Maybe you could even start wearing them yourself *GASP*.

In summation: If she wants to ride, help her the best you can. Make sure you set a good example to reinforce the positive habits and help her unlearn any negative habits she may pick up (no, I don't view mesh as a negative habit). Accept the fact that while she may not be wearing full biker gang leathers, she's wearing protection that has been proven to help absorb some of the impact in the event of an accident and help keep her skin on her body. Make sure she understands that Harley isn't the only motorcycle company on Earth, and you could even stop sneering at everything that isn't a Harley to maybe help convince her that a starter bike isn't a bad idea. You could also let her be what she wants to be instead of trying to make her be what you want to be. If you want Susie Homemaker, go find yourself a Susie Homemaker. If you want her, then stop bitching that you two may have something else in common shortly.

I'm not going to get into the nitty-gritty of relationship details and everything else that strikes me as horribly wrong in your post, but perhaps you should take a step back and reevaluate what it is you want in a relationship.

I love what you wrote. You saved me having to tell her she doesn't own her.

Will you marry me? J/K.....

[koji52]

blues...ryethil is a lady. haha