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I think i read somewhere that cows arent killed for the leather, and that it is taken when they are killed for food or something like that.

A British comic I heard said...

He worked in a slaughterhouse, and people would protest... "Meat is Murder!"

He said, meat is not murder. If we could have gotten the meat off them any other way, we would have. Meat is justifiable homicide.

Laughed then, more of a smirk now.

Yes, cows are killed primarily for the meat, but if you are opposed to that industry, there is no sense helping them profit.

And, in the grand scheme of things, skin/hide is flesh, thus meat. It just happens to be meat that is not very pallatable, and more useful in other areas.

I am glad one vegetarian showed up! Veggie and a Kawa rider too! - Loonette, I can justify leather in a similar fashion (no insult meant by "justify")... Beef production is so ridiculously high that to not use the hide for leather would be more offensive (you know we'd burn it or something ). Cow hide leather is nowhere near as offensive as snake, shark, eel, aligator... Why not just make shoes out of your dog when he dies?

OK... Now I feel like I am proselytizing. Stopping now

--Dave

I can't believe you endorse eating all those poor plants. I bet you don't even cook them half the time...eating them alive...yuk!

Next time you dig into a salad, think of the murder. I thank goodness plants dont have a nervous system as you grind them up with your teeth. That plant could have lived for years, giving us oxygen and natural beauty, but instead you have to go and eat it. Ugh.

But I know the good argument...killing for food is okay if they don't feel pain right?

ARTIST: Arrogant Worms
TITLE: Carrot Juice Is Murder
Lyrics and Chords


Listen up, brothers and sisters
Come hear my desperate tale
I speak of our friends of nature
Trapped in the dirt like a jail

Vegetables live in oppression
Served on our tables each night
This killing of veggies is madness
I say we take up the fight

Salads are only for murderers
Cole slaw's a fascist regime
Don't think that they don't have feelings
Just 'cause a radish can't scream

{Refrain}
I've heard the screams of the vegetables, scream scream scream
Watching their skins being peeled, having their insides revealed
Grated and steamed with no mercy, burning off calories
How do you think that feels, bet it hurts really bad
Carrot juice constitutes murder, and that's a real crime
Greenhouses prisons for slaves, let my vegetables grow
It's time to stop all this gardening, it's dirty as hell
Let's call a spade a spade, it's a spade it's a spade it's a spade

I saw a man eating celery
So I beat him black and blue
If he ever touches a sprout again
I'll bite him clean in two

I'm a political prisoner
Trapped in a windowless cage
'Cause I stopped the slaughter of turnips
By killing five men in a rage

I told the judge when he sentenced me
"This is my finest hour
I'll kill those farmers again
Just to save one more cauliflower"

{Refrain}

How low as people do we dare to stoop
Making young broccolis bleed in the soup
Untie your beans, uncage your tomatoes
Set potted plants free, don't mash that potato, ah

I've heard the screams of the vegetables scream scream scream
Watching their skins being peeled fates in the stir fry are sealed
Grated and steamed with no mercy you fat gourmet scum
How do you think that feels leave them out in the fields
Carrot juice constitutes murder V8's genocide
Greenhouses prisons for slaves yes your compost's a grave
It's time to stop all this gardening take up macramé
Let's call a spade a spade it's a spade it's a spade it's a spade

Now, this is all from memory. Link below to possibly better info.

The Jainist believed it was wrong to sustain themselves on anything but air. One of their leaders was reputed to live on one grain of rice a day, and felt it necessary to atone for that.

In case the above is complete cr@p, please see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jainist

--David

Ah Wiki...the most worthless encyclopedia ever created

With many thanks to Douglas Adams, here is the best thing on the whole vegan issue I have ever read:


The waiter approached.
'Would you like to see the menu?' he said,
'or would you like meet the Dish of the Day?'

'Huh?' said Ford.
'Huh?' said Arthur.
'Huh?' said Trillian.
'That's cool,' said Zaphod, 'we'll meet the meat.'

- snip -

A large dairy animal approached Zaphod Beeblebrox's table,
a large fat meaty quadruped of the bovine type with
large watery eyes, small horns and what might almost have
been an ingratiating smile on its lips.

'Good evening', it lowed and sat back heavily on its haunches,
'I am the main Dish of the Day. May I interest you in the parts
of my body?'

It harrumphed and gurgled a bit, wriggled its hind quarters in
to a more comfortable position and gazed peacefully at them.

Its gaze was met by looks of startled bewilderment from
Arthur and Trillian, a resigned shrug from Ford Prefect and
naked hunger from Zaphod Beeblebrox.

'Something off the shoulder perhaps?' suggested the animal,
'Braised in a white wine sauce?'

'Er, your shoulder?' said Arthur in a horrified whisper.

'But naturallymy shoulder, sir,' mooed the animal contentedly,
'nobody else's is mine to offer.'

Zaphod leapt to his feet and started prodding and feeling
the animal's shoulder appreciatively.

'Or the rump is very good,' murmured the animal. 'I've been
exercising it and eating plenty of grain, so there's a lot
of good meat there.'

It gave a mellow grunt, gurgled again and started to chew
the cud. It swallowed the cud again.

'Or a casselore of me perhaps?' it added.

'You mean this animal actually wants us to eat it?' whispered
Trillian to Ford.

'Me?' said Ford, with a glazed look in his eyes, 'I don't mean
anything.'

'That's absolutely horrible,' exclaimed Arthur, 'the most revolting
thing I've ever heard.'

'What's the problem Earthman?' said Zaphod, now transfering his
attention to the animal's enormous rump.

'I just don't want to eat an animal that's standing there
inviting me to,' said Arthur, 'It's heartless.'

'Better than eating an animal that doesn't want to be
eaten,' said Zaphod.

'That's not the point,' Arthur protested. Then he thought about it
for a moment. 'Alright,' he said, 'maybe it is the point. I don't
care, I'm not going to think about it now. I'll just ... er ... I
think I'll just have a green salad,' he muttered.

'May I urge you to consider my liver?' asked the animal,
'it must be very rich and tender by now, I've been force-feeding
myself for months.'

'A green salad,' said Arthur emphatically.

'A green salad?' said the animal, rolling his eyes disapprovingly
at Arthur.

'Are you going to tell me,' said Arthur, 'that I shouldn't have
green salad?'

'Well,' said the animal, 'I know many vegetables that are
very clear on that point. Which is why it was eventually
decided to cut through the whoile tangled problem and breed
an animal that actually wanted to be eaten and was capable of
saying so clearly and distinctly. And here I am.'

It managed a very slight bow.

'Glass of water please,' said Arthur.

'Look,' said Zaphod, 'we want to eat, we don't want to make
a meal of the issues. Four rare stakes please, and hurry.
We haven't eaten in five hundred and sevebty-six thousand
million years.'

The animal staggered to its feet. It gave a mellow gurgle.
'A very wise coice, sir, if I may say so. Very good,' it
said, 'I'll just nip off and shoot myself.'

He turned and gave a friendly wink to Arthur.
'Don't worry, sir,' he said, 'I'll be very humane.'

It waddled unhurriedly off to the kitchen.


From the book "The Restaurant at the End of the Universe" by Douglas Adams

If God didn't want us to eat animals, he wouldn't have made them so dam tasty!

I'm an unabashed carnivore, but think vegetarians (all types) are entitled to follow their own conscience regardless of the underlying reasons. I do draw the line, however, when extremists try to interfere with my choices.

Safety-boy wrote:

The Jainist believed it was wrong to sustain themselves on anything but air. One of their leaders was reputed to live on one grain of rice a day, and felt it necessary to atone for that.

The operative word in the second sentence is "reputed." Presumably the Jainists have since discovered the natural darwinian consequence of trying to live on air alone, or have found some intellectual accomodation for living out a meager existence making constant atonement for their disgraceful acts of [natural human] consumption.

Sorry, I don't have time to respond to the poll. I'm too busy munching on a cheese burger.