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Nalian wrote:To ignore any extreme fundamentalism would be woefully ignorant. Last I checked, Timothy McVey was not islamic, and he certainly did a ton of damage.

Extremists come in all colors, religions, shapes and sizes. If you start looking for just one, another will bite us all in the "O Ring" later. Suggestions to focus on just one group suggest a severe lack of understanding of the whole picture.

What is it about Europeans and Canadians that makes them absolutely refuse to admit the war on terrorism is between the West and Islamic extremists??

I don't think anyone proposed ignoring other extremists, as a matter of fact I am quite sure all extremist groups are well monitored by all western intelligence and law enforcement agencies. Why is that reasoning used as a sort of cop-out?

younggun- Also, I don't wish to take the time to correct someone with skewed and only passing knowledge of the subject of WWII.

swatter555 wrote:younggun- Also, I don't wish to take the time to correct someone with skewed and only passing knowledge of the subject of WWII.

Are you trying to say the US won the war?

swatter555 wrote:

Nalian wrote:To ignore any extreme fundamentalism would be woefully ignorant. Last I checked, Timothy McVey was not islamic, and he certainly did a ton of damage.

Extremists come in all colors, religions, shapes and sizes. If you start looking for just one, another will bite us all in the "O Ring" later. Suggestions to focus on just one group suggest a severe lack of understanding of the whole picture.

What is it about Europeans and Canadians that makes them absolutely refuse to admit the war on terrorism is between the West and Islamic extremists??

What is it about people who disagree that choose to put a disagreement on a country affiliation? All American here, baby. Born in CA, raised all over the west coast, now living in Boston. If that ain't American - no one here is.

The "War on Terror" is about Bush and his lack of ability to admit that you cannot fight a war against a terrorist. At least not by any sense of the word war that I am familiar with. It's a complete misnomer, like the war on drugs. "Lets have a war against fear." Uh, yeah, that'll work. Call it what it is. We are against Al Quada no matter what religion, nationality, etc, they are. Terrorists as well. But right now, the biggest bringer of actual terror - as in its definition - is often the media and our administration.

Recently a website I like to frequent had a great 2/3 minute vid on it very succinctly describing why I hate this whole propagandist war. You can see it here:

http://www.zefrank.com/theshow/archives ... 81006.html#

First 15/20 seconds are not applicable, rest of it is.

Nice vid Nalian.

I have to completely agree with zefrank on this topic.

The terrorists don't even have to actually kill anyone in order to completely demoralize and paralyze an entire country.

Look at what the new 'security measures' are doing to the US right now. Air travel is quickly becoming so arduous to get through all the bureaucratic BS that people just aren't going to fly anywhere anymore. It is quickly becoming more feasible to drive to your destination, even with the higher price of fuel.

Taking security measures to the point of banning things like nail clippers and cans of coke is ridiculous. What the heck are you going to do with a set of nail clippers?

And banning things like shampoo, deodorant (which does come in gel form, now banned), toothpaste, etc..... is not going to stop terrorists - it will however ban the average traveller who is not going to want to have to wait half a day to get through security, have half their stuff confiscated so that they can buy replacements at their destination and have it all confiscated again on their return flight.

The terrorists don't even have to do anything on US soil in order to get the American people all tensed up and hyperventilating themselves; they can do it from the other side of the planet.

And a homegrown terrorist still has all kinds of nasty stuff at his disposal to wreak havoc; ever wonder what could be done with commercially available, uncontrolled items like Radio Controlled airplanes and model rocket engines? Everything one needs to build a heat seeking missile can be purchased off the rack at Radio Shack. The beauty of it is that most of the stuff would be virtually untraceable.

Want to make Napalm? mix some gasoline with styrofoam packing peanuts.

Want to make it even nastier? buy some Magnesium or phosphorus from online chemistry supply shops.

Popular Science a couple of months ago had a brief bit on how to make Thermite in their How 2.0 section.

Want to do some serious damage to US morale? Hid a small dirty nuke in a shipping container buried in the middle of a whole bunch of others on a cargo ship, then detonate the sucker when it gets into port. Won't do as much damage as an airburst, but it's sure going to cripple the US economy, not to mention make a large chunk of real estate completely unlivable.

how could anyone be expected to travel without their toiletries??
the end is surely nearing for the sissies.

I've got a great idea. Let's just make airport parking lots bigger like from New York to California. Then we can restrict ALL passengers on all flights. By the time you park near the terminal, you'll actually be where you were trying to get to in the first place.

Nalian wrote:

swatter555 wrote:

Nalian wrote:To ignore any extreme fundamentalism would be woefully ignorant. Last I checked, Timothy McVey was not islamic, and he certainly did a ton of damage.

Extremists come in all colors, religions, shapes and sizes. If you start looking for just one, another will bite us all in the "O Ring" later. Suggestions to focus on just one group suggest a severe lack of understanding of the whole picture.

What is it about Europeans and Canadians that makes them absolutely refuse to admit the war on terrorism is between the West and Islamic extremists??

What is it about people who disagree that choose to put a disagreement on a country affiliation? All American here, baby. Born in CA, raised all over the west coast, now living in Boston. If that ain't American - no one here is.

The "War on Terror" is about Bush and his lack of ability to admit that you cannot fight a war against a terrorist. At least not by any sense of the word war that I am familiar with. It's a complete misnomer, like the war on drugs. "Lets have a war against fear." Uh, yeah, that'll work. Call it what it is. We are against Al Quada no matter what religion, nationality, etc, they are. Terrorists as well. But right now, the biggest bringer of actual terror - as in its definition - is often the media and our administration.

Recently a website I like to frequent had a great 2/3 minute vid on it very succinctly describing why I hate this whole propagandist war. You can see it here:

http://www.zefrank.com/theshow/archives ... 81006.html#

First 15/20 seconds are not applicable, rest of it is.

I have no stomach to widen this discussion to include luny left anti-Bush hysteria.

I wouldn't let the ratings driven media be the barometer as to how afraid America is of terrorism. The media is a master of over-hyping to an insane degree anything related to terrorism.

"We are against Al Quada no matter what religion"

I know the religion doesn't matter to you, but it does to them. Just go to the Jihadi web sites and read it for yourself. You want to make it secular, they have no such delusions. It has everying to do with religion, just ask em. They are on a mission from God, they want to die for God. They want you to die because you don't believe in thier God.

Also, I have heard Bush on many, many occasions say the "War on Terror" is not a conventional war. Don't let real facts get in your way, though.


And once again there seems to be a blind refusal to admit we are fighting a war against Islamic fundamentalism. We are not fighting a group of people as much as we are fighting an idealogy. That idealogy is Islamic fundamentalism. In this case, you cannot seperate the idealogy and the religion is purports to be fighting for. Without religion, what the terrorists do makes no sense!

Let some one put forward a coherent agrument as to why religion isn't important here. Bring it forward, I would like to understand.

younggun wrote:

swatter555 wrote:younggun- Also, I don't wish to take the time to correct someone with skewed and only passing knowledge of the subject of WWII.

Are you trying to say the US won the war?

I am telling you to pick up a book and find out for yourself.


Edit- Alright, Ill give a real answer. It would be accurate to say the Allies won the war. It would also be accurate to say that the US enabled the Allies not only to win, but prevent the post-war domination of western Europe by the communists. It would also be accurate to say that without the US, Europe would have been domintated by either Hitler or Stalin. Not a pleasant thought.

"The terrorists don't even have to actually kill anyone in order to completely demoralize and paralyze an entire country."

Only a media driven perception. It would be more accurate to say that terrorists drive the media into a frenzy, rather than the average person.