Latest "school shooting" scare

[Sev]

Well sorry for making up the facts, but I couldn't recall them all. I did make a lot of leaps based upon what I could remember reading in the past. Sorry again for the inacurracies and thank you for setting them straight.

And thank you for sharing the extra details. I'm glad to hear you see things in the society and don't live in a compound. Mostly I was commenting on what I percieved as a likely set of situation that made your possition make sense. Some makes less sense now that I know that you have a broader scope of reference, but hey, you believe what you think is right. More power to ya.

Just for future reference. If you want your side of a debate to hold any water at all. You NEED to be sure of ANY fact/idea that you bring to table. Relatively minor innacuracies, such as you've presented multiple times in this thread, and assumptions that are not based on facts undermine anything else that you have to say.

Loonette, the Airsoft guns are indeed toys. They are designed to be fired at people without doing injury. There were a couple bb or pellet guns that are definitely not designed to be fired at people, but are still basically toys. There was one firearm pictured. I was griping that the media was making it out to be a table chock-full of eeevil assault weapons.

Thanks for the tidbit, but as I've explained, there was more going on than just what the photo showed. Hand grenades, homemade bombs, and three guns fully capable of inflicting death were in the home. Yes, yes, they also showed images of his other "toys" that he had been "collecting" since his childhood, but that's what they found, so they showed it. I'm sorry that YOU fell into the media trap (the same as those who Shorts fear will strip away her liberties), but there was more going on with the story if you had only looked beyond the web-posted photo.

The problem that I have with your final statement is that there is no proof there were other weapons in the house. At least that's been provided thus far. I've yet to do ANY digging myself. But the media merely saying that said weapons were there is not enough for me. I need to see them.

Hell, last week a biker T-boned a car up here. The media made it out to be the bikers fault... the fact that the car ran a red light apparently wasn't relevant to the discussion.

[mgdavis]

From what I have been able to discern, the actual weapons found in the house consisted of:
One Hipoint carbine in 9mm.
One plastic "grenade" filled with bb's and gunpowder. There were apparently more of these devices that had not had the powder added.

There was one .22 rifle and one .22 pistol peripherally involved in the story, they were stored at a friend's house.

There was zero ammunition found. There were zero hand grenades. Loonette, you are the one that has fallen into the media trap, looking only at the surface of what was presented. If you look at my original post, all I was doing was saying: "Hey, those weren't real AK's and shotguns and pistols and RPKs on the table. The only real one is the Hipoint." The only thing I was doing was attempting to correct the impression given by the media sensationalism of that picture, nothing more. I didn't say anything about anything else, and never intended this to turn into the big flame-fest it became.

I'm done with this thread now, everybody here is fully entitled to their own opinions and I'm not going to try to change them. I'll stick with pointing out fact.

We both ride bikes, and that is cool. So I call peace.

What he said.

[Shorts]

"poo poo" Loonette, if you aren't going to read the entire thread in order to understand the entire conversation and why points are stated, I'm not going to cut and paste individual quotes in order to create Cliff's Notes for you.


You're an adult. You can read. You don't...scratch that, shouldn't need your answers spoon-fed to you. Reading comprehension - get some. If you'd shut your mouth for a minute and instead of looking for ways to insult me and put "Shorts" as the focus of this thread, I've explained the concept to you in its entirety.

I'm done with this thread as well. There's really no way to draw in Crayon on a computer screen.


@ Scan. Hell, I'll buy you two

[Loonette]

The problem that I have with your final statement is that there is no proof there were other weapons in the house. At least that's been provided thus far. I've yet to do ANY digging myself. But the media merely saying that said weapons were there is not enough for me. I need to see them.

The weapons I mentioned were shown and listed verbally on camera during a news conference held by the police. So since I wasn't in the house myself, I guess I don't really have proof either - maybe the police are lying as well as the media?

[matthew5656]

Whether this troubled kid merely owned a BB gun and a book of matches, or instead a homemade bomb and a rocket launcher, this event must not be thrown out the window, downsized, or discarded. This person had an intention to injure or kill another human being. That would be like brushing off a squid who's parents bought him a Ninja 250 but forget that any one can kill anyone with any machine, regardless of it's limitation. Obviously a little 250 standard can cause a lot of damage, much like a 9mm Hi Point carbine can. I read earlier that it does "shoot pretty dang straight".......

I do not believe banning the right to gun ownership is a correct solution. I am far from accordance with that idea. But I am appalled that his mother provided weapons for him so carelessly and with little difficulty. Everyone should have the right to purchase a weapon, but I, and the people who I love and care for, would feel safer if professional training and certain policy and legislation were required to obtain ownership.

But you know what else I think? I think this entire thread has exploded way out of proportion. Once the definition of a semi-automatic weapon became such an important matter, this turned into a waste of everyone's time. Some people like to hear themselves type. And type very loud I might add.

Loonette, I understand your reaction to what could have taken place if the person's intentions had not been revealed. Any caring mother or father would be rightly concerned. If my son or daughter were in danger of troubled, imbalanced children and careless providers of fatal weapons, I'd be very concerned and raise my voice over the matter as well. But maybe that idea is something only a mother or father can fully understand.

And Loonette, I Never heard you suggest any idea associated with a dismissal of ownership rights or bring forth an anti-gun agenda. I think your deepest concerns and feelings about this matter were blatantly turned around and put against you.

Like I said before, some enjoy hearing themselves type about something that was never brought up initially. Maybe someone should begin a new thread about gun ownership rights and responsibility. I don't appreciate when idiots criticize and flip a parent's concern for their closest and most cherished thing in their lives.

[Wrider]

Well, I've finally decided to jump into the mix on this one. I'll do my best to stick to the facts and my personal experiences.

The kid had a 9mm Hi-Point carbine.
He had SEVERAL Air-Soft pistols, machine guns, grenades, etc.
They were all laid out on a table.
They were said to be "realistic-looking weapons"
He may or may not have had a .22 rifle and a .22 pistol stored at a friend's house.

First off let me say. Personally I own guns. I shoot them, I hunt with them, I am extremely cautious with them. I respect what they can do, but do not treat them as though they are a higher power as some do.

The 9mm Hi-Point carbine. This is one I have experience with. I've shot a friend's and I personally own a Hi-Point 9mm pistol. Good gun for the money, as long as you don't expect it to be happy with hollow-points, lead-tips, or anything other than full metal jackets. Anything other than that they jam rather easily. The carbine uses the same clip as my pistol. IIRC the clip holds 8 rounds, plus one in the chamber. There are no extended magazines on the market for it, trust me, I've looked.
I do realize that this machine was designed to kill and destroy. But keep in mind that it was mostly designed to kill and destroy those poor defenseless paper animals held up by boards at the end of the shooting range. Because of the size of the round, it's basically useless for hunting, and because of the size of the gun it's basically useless for home defense unless you've got a house with LONG hallways. In other words, there's a reason I chose the pistol instead. It's more maneuverable, more versatile, more tactical, and only loses 75 fps over the carbine. Not much when you're talking bullet speeds.

The .22s. Again, I have experience with these. I learned to shoot on these, I still own one, and probably always will. I respect what they can do for being such a small round. If it's true he had a rifle and a pistol, then if he ever went off he might have done some damage.
BUT
.22 shots are not the worst. I PERSONALLY know people who have been shot with them, and yeah, they hurt, yeah, there was blood loss, usually a hospital visit, but even when it hit a vital part of the body, the ribs or some other bone would deflect the bullet and keep the person safe.
BEFORE YOU EMTS AND SUCH JUMP ON ME
No, I'm not a bioengineer or anything, this is based on personal experience.
I'm not saying you can't be killed by a .22, in fact it's rather easy. Heck, it's the preferred method of hit men for the mob, enough energy to pierce the skull once, not twice. It can and will pierce any flesh on a person.
But I'd much rather be shot by a .22 than a 9mm.

As for the Air-Softs. Are you kidding me??? Honestly... I've owned, played with, been shot with, shot people with. etc etc etc Air-Softs for years.
Some of them look real, some of them don't. Anyone with a decent eye for guns can usually tell the difference between them. They hurt, yeah, they leave welts, they even leave bruises. So does tag, so does football, so does soccer... This is long range tag... I mean, it's not bad, and the faster the shots repeat (such as out of the ak-47 lookalike) the slower the pellets actually fire. I haven't seen the actual pictures, but if they're what I've seen in stores and in catalogs, then it's fake looking, 3/4 scale, plastic...

If you have any questions or criticisms for me, feel free to PM me, and I'll answer any questions you may have, whether I like the answer or not.
Wrider

[Sev]

LoL,

from experience air-softs hurt exactly enough to act as a VERY good incentive to not get shot again. YOUCH!

[Wrider]

LoL,

from experience air-softs hurt exactly enough to act as a VERY good incentive to not get shot again. YOUCH!

Another reason to have my size... Plenty of insulation and give...
Wrider

[Sev]

Yeah, but you've got twice as much to hit. I'll stick with skinny thank you very much. There are statistically fewer muzzle angles that will result in me being hit compared to you being hit.

Tiddy boom.

[Wrider]

Lol very true, can't deny that... Ever wonder why I own so much firepower? So that I can take care of threats before they get into their own effective range...
Wrider