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Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:27 am
by MrGompers
NorthernPete wrote:Have you considered maybe getting parts through a scrap yard? I mean, some of the smaller things that you'd be able to do yourself, the turn signal and break peddle for instance?
I have considered that. As it turns out they won't be replacing the break pedal just bending it back into place. The one thing I prolly could find in a junkyard is the turn signal lens. I'm surprised you can't buy the lens seperately. AS for the master cylinder I would want a new one. I wouldn't want to risk braking ability with something from a junkyard. Brakes are too important on a bike.

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:40 am
by NorthernPete
MrGompers wrote:Brakes are too important on a bike.

My whole bike came from a junk yard, the brakes work fine.... although my boots are getting worn out *L

New parts rock, I wish I could get them for my oldie.

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:44 am
by MrGompers
NorthernPete wrote:
MrGompers wrote:Brakes are too important on a bike.

My whole bike came from a junk yard, the brakes work fine.... although my boots are getting worn out *L

New parts rock, I wish I could get them for my oldie.
LOL!!

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 10:48 am
by MikeyDude
This is a post made on a different forum by a very respected MSF trainer and motorcycle safety guru on this very topic. His name is James R. Davis... This is his idea on how to handle this kind of situation...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


I wonder how many of you have heard and bought the advice that the MSF and most 'right thinking' instructors have given you that if a threat presents itself to you then you have ONE choice to make: EITHER brake or swerve?

Now let me be clear here, we are talking about a PANIC situation. We have all both braked and changed directions at the same time with some regularity. Consider what you do when you pull into a parking spot, for example. At those times you are using so little traction that braking and turning at the same time is not dangerous as you have lots of traction left. But in a panic situation you are deliberately trying to brake hard enough that the front tire is almost skidding so it's clear that there is very little traction left to try to change directions as well. (Besides, the righting force caused by trail makes it almost impossible to do.)

So, I suspect that we all agree that you really do have only that one choice to make in a panic situation: EITHER brake or swerve.

But are those choices in any way 'equal'? Is one choice DEFINITIONALLY SAFER, EASIER, and more likely to result is a satisfactory outcome than the other?

I'm here to tell you that a PANIC STOP is your best friend!!!! Any other maneuver is GUARANTEED to result in a crash (if there is a crash) with you moving faster than you would have had you elected to do the PANIC STOP.

Here is a diagram that demonstrates only the most obvious reason:


Image


In this scenario you are moving at 40 MPH and an 18-wheeler crosses your path. You can choose to panic stop or panic swerve. If you panic stop you will hit the truck at 20 MPH. If you panic swerve you will hit it at 40 MPH. Which choice makes the most sense?

Notice, please, the dashed red line. That is the course change that you would have to make if you elected to change your mind after you started the panic stop and released your brakes in order to try a panic swerve. It is IMPOSSIBLE!!!! In other words, if you start a panic stop you MUST commit to it. It ends with a successful stop or a crash, nothing else. You CANNOT change your mind after you start a panic stop and expect to get a better outcome.

Of course there are times that a panic swerve will allow you to not hit the threat in front of you. But in virtually every case (not all! - the car in the wrong lane coming head on, for example) where that is true if you had panic stopped instead you would not have hit the threat and come to a complete stop at the end of the effort.

So, we are finally at the REAL ISSUE relative to panic swerves: THEY ARE NOT MERELY HARD RIGHT OR HARD LEFT CHANGES OF DIRECTION!!!!! They are THREE consecutive hard changes of direction. That is, a successful panic swerve is an *S* turn where you make a hard, say 20 degree lean, to one side, then an even harder 40 degree reverse lean in the other direction, followed by a third hard reverse lean back up to vertical.

It is almost unthinkable that you have charted in your mind the course you will take beyond the first hard lean when you begin that panic swerve. In other words, when you decide to do a panic swerve you are committing your bike to move into a direction that is GUARANTEED TO BE INTO DANGER - off road, in a ditch, or onto the grill of an oncoming car - while moving at speed (maybe a lot more than 40 MPH). THEN, with a ton of adrenaline running through your body, you must make TWO MORE AGGRESSIVE direction changes before you can once again be moving in the direction the roadway points.

To believe that with that adrenaline pouring through your veins you are NOT going to reach for your binders is foolishness at best. In other words, a panic swerve will, with high odds, cause you to have to do a panic stop anyway!!!!

What's the message here?

While you may EITHER PANIC STOP or PANIC SWERVE, you should be so predisposed to choosing to PANIC STOP that you do not waste time making that decision and get on your binders as quickly as you can - and then STAY ON THEM. A PANIC SWERVE is a very poor second choice, almost always. So poor, in fact, that you should essentially forget about it.

Practice emergency braking to the point that your instincts take over in a panic situation and you can quickly and safely CONTROL your bike until that maneuver is over. COMMIT TO IT - it is your best friend

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:05 am
by TheImp
But if its an 18 wheeler, if you can swerve tightly enough and brake had you might be able to get enough clearance beneath it to low side it through, just like in the movies! :laughing:

But seriously, what you posted is very good information. Basically damage control. If you're going to be in a collision, try and minimize the impact by using a panic stop.

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:11 am
by NorthernPete
Ummm hit the transport at 20 or 40... can I get neither? :laughing:

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:16 am
by MrGompers
That was a very informative post. In my incident I did do a panic stop. I wanted to reduce the amount of impact force as quickly as possible. This was talked about in the MSF & in proficient motorcycling. I agree with the advice too. It makes sense that hitting something at 20mph is better than hitting it at 40mph.
When I saw that I was gonna hit the cage anyway I must've tried to swerve. I can't confirm that since this happened so quickly but would bet on it. Its a natural instinct to move out of the way of an obsticle. No doubt that swerve attempt sent me down eating pavement.

I suppose if I did hit the cage he wouldn't have been able to leave the scene & the cops would've showed up. Hopefully, ticketing the cager and giving me the oppotunity for a beat down.

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:20 am
by MikeyDude
Well the other thing if you hit him would be that his insurance would be paying for your damages. I totally understand your reaction in this pucker situation. It's a tough thing to figure out...

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 11:28 am
by MrGompers
Mikeydude wrote:Well the other thing if you hit him would be that his insurance would be paying for your damages. I totally understand your reaction in this pucker situation. It's a tough thing to figure out...
Yeah thats true. I'm out of pocket $325 on this one. If I did hit him tho it would've caused much more damage. Bent rim & forks come to mind.

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2006 12:01 pm
by NorthernPete
Its amazing what some people will do when they get all flustered, the flight or flight thing et al. Id be pissed as well, but at least you were able to walk away from it. and you got a good bar story.