YZF 600 as a starter?

[NuRida]

. chances are ill see a memorial along the side of the road with your name on it.

where would you decide to Learn to swim. the kiddie pool or the shark invested 10 foot high waves of the ocean?

listen buddy, you say that one more time and im gunna snap, where do you come off telling me im gunna die, and trying to scare me like that, thats a pretty low thing to do.

[iwannadie]

. chances are ill see a memorial along the side of the road with your name on it.

where would you decide to Learn to swim. the kiddie pool or the shark invested 10 foot high waves of the ocean?

listen buddy, you say that one more time and im gunna snap, where do you come off telling me im gunna die, and trying to scare me like that, thats a pretty low thing to do.

glad you finally faced reality for a moment then.

[Mag7C]

Well I can't relate...I guess some people have a knack for hand controls, and some don't.

In my own defense, it was because I was still learning the feel of my bike and trying to keep it from tipping. My first bike was really topheavy, and I was practicing U-turns. I learned the hard way not to lean in low speed turns, because even my slight lean caused the bike to tip. So my mind went from concentrating on clutch control and look-where-you-go to "DONT DROP THE BIKE!!!". I guess the funky wrist angle caused me to give it a sudden twist as I was wrenching it back up, and cutting to the point, the bike ended up on the ground anyway . It was already a beater when I bought it, so the only damage was ego damage.

I'm a really good painter though!

It might still be a good idea to buy a cheap bike to practice on at least to get a feel of what a motorcycle in general is like. Mine was $700 when I bought it, then sold it for $750 surprisingly. Of course there were maintenance expenses, so in all I was probably down about a hundred bucks. Not too bad though for all the good times I had with it. Selling it was... well, I don't like to talk about that .

[NorthernPete]

Geesh, NuRider, go out and get your bike, either you'll do great and come back telling us we talk out our ases, or you'll wrap yourself around a telephone pole. either way, itll be settled.

[Sev]

Well I can't relate...I guess some people have a knack for hand controls, and some don't. And that's why nobody has any business telling someone else what kind of bike to start on.

I have exactly two things to say to that:
1) you might think you're constantly in control of your throttle but one day some pothole or dog or car or something will make you realize that you aren't.
2) he asked for our opinions, then ignored them. When he ASKED that made it OUR BUSINESS to offer our opinions. When he came to us it became our job to offer advice.



As to what bike I'd suggest. I say start with a standard or a cruiser, not a sportbike. There are very few new riders who will be able to get out there and use a 600cc sportbike to its full potential. So why do you need it to learn on?

Because I WANT TO LOOK COOL! *subtext*Dropping it in the intersection.

[Sev]

Maturity is not the issue here, taking it easy is not the issue here. Skill is the issue here. And you don't have any, not yet. So do you want a bike that will forgive the mistakes you are going to make while you are learning? Or do you want a bike that will do exactly what you tell it to do and catapult you into the sidewalk?

So what, pray tell, is this perfect starter bike that is unable to be crashed? All 250cc mopeds aside, I'm gonna assume the Kawasaki Ninja 500R is on your list of approved starter bikes, so let's compare, shall we?

- The 500R weighs 388lbs vs. the YZF600's 412lbs

- The 500R has a 30.5" seat height vs. the YZF600's 31.7"

- The 500R has a 56.5" wheelbase vs. the YZF600's 55.7"

- The 500R's rake and trail are 27/3.6 vs. the YZF600's 25/3.82

So, the only differences here are two things:

1) The YZF600R has more power, and therefore more speed potential

2) The YZF600R is probably much sexier than the bike you and most others started on, and that just burns you up inside!

Personally I wouldn't point someone at a ninja 500r unless they have a bunch of dirtbiking experience, or were looking for a second bike. I'm all about cruisers or standards to learn on. That being said lets compare one or two other similarities between the bikes....

Ninja - inline 2 at 499cc classification - sportbike
YZF - inline 4 at 599cc classifitcation - supersport bike

Ninja-
Horsepower = 40 about at 11,000 rpm

YZF -
Horsepower Claimed 94.6 bhp @ 11,000 rpm
Torque Claimed 47.72 ft-lb @ 9500 rpm

If the two bikes are that similar, why not go for the cheaper one? I mean... there's a REALLY good chance he'll tip it at least once wouldn't it make more sense to beat up the cheaper bike?

I mean, anyone who buys a bike based on SEX APPEAL needs to do some serious reconsidering of the sport. At least in my opinion.

click me!

But I don't know, I mean I've never ridden a motorcycle before, I come here just to hang out. Everything that I've ever said on here I've learned from the internet... a lot of it from these guys. My practical experience is zero. So I'll cede to your desires and vastly superior knowledge... though I have yet to read ANYTHING about what you've done on a bike except your supreme mastery of your throttle... on your cruiser... and let whatever happens rest on your head. I mean you seem qualified to give advice you have a MC pic in your avatar. Personally I'm really hoping that he doesn't get hurt. Roadrash takes forever to heal.

BTW this would be my suggestions for a 600+ to start on:

Yamaha v-star
Suzuki c40

You know the ninja 250 can hit 100mph?

[Toyuzu]

Wow, this thread has gotten a bit out of control since the last time I checked it. Here's my take on this whole situation:

First: The lot of you, with a few exceptions are making fools of yourselves. The point of these forums is to share a common love for motorcycles, and riding them. NOT to have adolescent posturing contests over differences of opinion.

My opinion on the 600 CC sportbike as a beginner bike - Not a good idea for MOST people. Notice I didn't say not a good idea for ALL people. It is true that some new riders have the mental design, and mechanical aptitude to handle a 600 CC sportbike as a first ride, but as an experienced rider I strongly suspect those people are in the minority.

Those of you who have your heart set on a 600 CC sportbike, the choice is ultimately yours, and you owe it to yourself to get as much info about them as you can before you make the jump. I understand that is what you're doing here, by the way - and good on ya for doing so. But please also understand that none of us here know a thing about you, and we have some degree of personal responsibility for the advice we dispense here, so it stands to reason that we will advise on the side of caution.

There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with starting small, and building skills in a reasonable manner, even if you CAN handle the 600. There IS, however EVERYTHING wrong with starting on a bike you're not prepared for, and winding up hurt or worse. Yes, smaller bikes can hurt you too, but they tend to be far more forgiving of mistakes than the others.

Now that's my two dollars. (Two cents won't buy anything anymore. )

[ZooTech]

but i am done with this thread. you are the forum tough guy, carry on with personal attacks and recomend all new riders go out and get a perfomance machine to learn on.

Yeah, I'm being real tough here...

Show me one of these personal attacks I've supposedly made. By suggesting that the only safe bike to learn on is a 250cc model, you're implying that that is what you learned on, or feel you should have learned on. All I'm saying is that bikes are not (and never have been) one size fits all. To me my Mean Streak feels just right...not too big, but definitely not small...but to someone else my bike might feel light a freakin' yacht. The CX500 I learned on weighed nearly 600lbs, and the seat height was so tall I had to stand on tip-toes at traffic lights. The brakes felt wooden, the tires were dry-rotted, and the engine was mounted too high in the frame making it very top-heavy...yet I survived the experience and went on to own a 700cc NightHawk and then a 1600cc Mean Streak. This notion that you have somehow mastered the skill of riding and are now "swimming in ten foot waves with sharks" is arrogant. If anything, he'll be lucky if he doesn't give the bike too little gas at a light and stall it. You have to twist the throttle pretty good to hit 4,000RPM, and those 600cc bikes don't have a whole lot of power down low anyway, so if he feels he can manage the clutch engagement than let him be. Admittedly, the way he phrased his question is a bit questionable, but the point here is that I think Ninja 250's and the like are more dangerous than helpful. If the whole point of riding them for learning's sake is to discover what it's like to travel on two wheels at speed, just tell everyone to buy a freakin' moped. They're cheap, weak, and only hit maybe 45mph, but they can master maneuvering just as well. Otherwise stop worrying that people will have as hard a time learning as you appear to have had.

...In my own defense, it was because I was still learning the feel of my bike and trying to keep it from tipping...

...It might still be a good idea to buy a cheap bike to practice on at least to get a feel of what a motorcycle in general is like...

Nothing wrong with that. You no doubt bought what you could afford and what you believed you could handle. I'm not advocating anything different here. My CX500 was only $800.00. I put about 3,000 miles on her before one of the exhaust valves on the right cylinder broke. I replaced the head, but the cam follower was damaged as well and the entire engine and tranny would have to be disassembled to replace it, so I parted the bike out on eBay for what I paid for it. Point is, though, the CX500 is one of the most unforgiving motorcycles I've ridden to date. No, not because of it's power...but because of it's crappy weight distribution, bad handling, and wooden brakes. But I don't prance around in front of newbies like I'm some sort of hero or something. Millions of people all around the world ride motorcycles.

you might think you're constantly in control of your throttle but one day some pothole or dog or car or something will make you realize that you aren't.

Seriously, Dude...if that's the way you honestly feel about it I truly hope you hang up your hat and never ride again. If you are not in control of your ride at all times you are a danger to everyone who is.

he asked for our opinions, then ignored them. When he ASKED that made it OUR BUSINESS to offer our opinions. When he came to us it became our job to offer advice.

Granted, he did open the door to suggestions and criticism...and I'm not defending him there. But you guys voiced your opinion, and I'm just voicing mine. If he said he wanted to learn on a VTX1800 I would tell him HELL NO! That bike is a top-heavy tank and takes some building-up to in order to handle it. But anything up to 800cc is fair game as far as learning is concerned. I care more about weight, handling, and center of gravity than power. Power can be modulated, the weight and handling cannot.

[macktruckturner]

I will add my $.02 carefully.

It is entirely possible for one to learn on a rocket, even one of the mildly tuned rockets, such as the YZF600R. I wouldn't personally advise it, but then I've done less intelligent things myself. As I replied in one of your mirror threads, you will have fun on anything with two wheels. Just like pivot steering donuts is just as fun in a M577A2/A3 as it is in a Bradley.

You can drop any bike, a 250cc cruiser, or a 1300cc rocket. The cost to you phsycially can be the same with either, ranging from a scraped knee, to permanent residence 6' below ground level. To be honest, I know a man that died in his garage, with a helmet on. He slipped backing his hog out of his garage on a patch of fine sand, and broke his neck, he was dead before anyone knew he'd fallen.

Whatever you do chose, and it would seem as though you have made your choice, exercise the utmost care. Take whatever courses you can to improve your skill, and always ride within your limits. It takes a man (or woman as the case may be) to know his/her limits and stick to them. It only takes a moment of confusion to result in the things statistics are made of.

The suggestions to ride a standard, cruiser, or other non-guided-missle style motorcycles come from experience. People are doing what they can to guide you to a lower potential for catastrophic mistakes. Like I said already, you can die backing out of your parking spot. You could die on the freeway in a F350 Super Duty too. I could hit an IED next time I roll outside the wire. The potential for death on the roadways in my example is probably lowest in the F350, and highest along Route Vanessa north of Bahgdad. Catch my drift? I wouldn't jump up and down and beg you to drive an open wheel racer down RTE Vanessa when I could request you do it in an armored M1114. Lower potential for dismemberment.

All that said, I spent 3 years putting around on 125cc-500cc bikes of various styles in a developing nation, as a 11-14yr old foreign national (US Citizen, non-military, in Malaysia). That probably wasn't smart, but it was fun. I have a fair deal of experience on two wheels. I've ridden a highly modified (track bike) GSXR750. I thought about accelerating, and the front wheel came off the ground at 70mph. Not expected, not cool. I will be buying a new SV650 over R&R in 2 months. Gets one from point A, to point B, with plenty of power, speed, class, and forgiveness.

YMMV, SSFD, VWP, ONVIAS.

Anthony

[MetalliCrusader]

I started on a Ninja 250, hence the avatar, and I almost died countless times. I assure you none of them were my fault. I got 100% on the MSF riding course and the written test, I obeyed all the traffic laws, etc. But I can't tell you how many times a guy in a Suburban on his cell phone almost killed me. I bought a decent condition "little" starter bike and had a blast with it. I don't know about yall, but I think 107MPH was fast enough for me on that bike, much less any bike.