are salespeople paid to over sell

[ZooTech]

There's nothing wrong with erring on the side of caution. There's also nothing wrong with expecting a newbie rider to take our advice into consideration, but not as the law written in stone. My very first experience on a street bike was riding a Ninja 600 when I was 16-years-old. Before that I had maybe two encounters with a mini bike in my younger years. The idea is to respect the motorcycle and treat all of its controls with very conservative inputs. This is true whether it's a 125cc Kawasaki Eliminator or a Triumph Rocket III.

And, the bikes I suggest are ones that I have personally ridden and have found to be free from surprises. If you haven't ridden an 1100 or 1600cc cruiser before I'm here to tell ya, they're not death machines. Yes, they're more powerful than the average bike but their power is very linear and predictable. I could easily imagine a big rider putting around a cul de sac on a V-Star 1100 for a few days - developing his or her skills in a safe, controlled environment. If someone is so green that the idea of learning both how to balance a bike AND operate its controls sounds too daunting, perhaps an MSF course or a scooter is in order. But that's ultimately up to the person asking the advice, not only to identify his or her skill level upon introduction, but also to ultimately make the correct purchase.

[bikeguy joe]

Zoo- I agree with what you're saying, but not everyone has that much restraint, or common sense unfortunately.

I have ridden some big bikes and my 800 Volusia is a small bike by some peoples standards. I may recommend it as a beginner bike, but only to those with a little common sense and co-ordination.

I can't really see anyione going 'round a cul-de-sac for a few days...it's just not human nature.

So, I stand by my suggestion to buy a small(er) used bike, and LEARN TO RIDE. Then, the sky's the limit. Well, that and your wallet......

[bikeguy joe]

Oh yeah, I failed to mention that if anyone turned me loose with a Ninja 600 as my first bike, it would probably have been my LAST bike! I'm sure I'd have turned the bike and myself into instant hamburger. I am (was when I was younger) one of the people with little common sense or restraint.

Maybe that's why I am so full of precautionary tales.

[ZooTech]

Zoo- I agree with what you're saying, but not everyone has that much restraint, or common sense unfortunately.

You're right, Joe. Unfortunately those are the guys who don't bother posting questions in a forum such as this, or if they would then they're the ones who won't listen to anything you suggest. If a guy, like this one for example, comes on here and demonstrates half-decent intelligence in his writing and demeanor then I make a judgement call and go from there. He's a bigger guy than I am and I find the V-Star 1100 to be a real pushover.

I have ridden some big bikes and my 800 Volusia is a small bike by some peoples standards. I may recommend it as a beginner bike, but only to those with a little common sense and co-ordination.

One more thing to consider, Joe, is that some would-be riders are simply barking up the wrong tree. A lot of the crashes you hear about are people who barely know how to drive a stick getting a motorcycle. But if a guy comes on here talking about how he's gone looking at 800's and 1100's, he's more than likely already assessed his abilities to some degree, and who am I to challenge that assessment?

I can't really see anyione going 'round a cul-de-sac for a few days...it's just not human nature.

True. But once again we're back to the death-wish boy racers who are eager to remove themselves from the gene pool. I helped place a newbie coworker on a Honda Hawk (1000cc sportbike) due to his massive size and he did putt around his cul de sac for at least two weeks before venturing out on adjacent streets. His patience and maturity paid off in spades, and he never even took the MSF course (they're pretty booked around here...I've never taken one, either).

So, I stand by my suggestion to buy a small(er) used bike, and LEARN TO RIDE. Then, the sky's the limit. Well, that and your wallet......

I think regardless of what sort of advice they receive here most newbie riders end up doing just that. It's easy to look back now in hindsight and realize just how easy this really is, but I can remember being intimidated by the thought of anything larger than a 250, even having ridden a 600 already.

Oh yeah, I failed to mention that if anyone turned me loose with a Ninja 600 as my first bike, it would probably have been my LAST bike! I'm sure I'd have turned the bike and myself into instant hamburger. I am (was when I was younger) one of the people with little common sense or restraint.

Yeah, that is a variable none of us can account for. I, personally, would like to think of myself as having an above average maturity level. I didn't get into any of the stereotypical teenager stuff (booze, pot, casual sex, parties, disobeying parents) so perhaps I'm expecting too much from others in this arena.

Maybe that's why I am so full of precautionary tales.

HaHA! Well, I've always said I won't take marriage advice from a single guy or parenting advice from someone with no kids. So, newbies coming here should be thankful you're here to show them the scars they could end up with if they listen to me!

[sapaul]

Funinaz seems like a sensible guy and we can only hope that he takes all of the comments that we have posted and draws a good conclusion from it. I can see both sides of the debate and can agree with aspects from both sides. My last comment is from an insurance perspective. After having talks with one of our underwriters, he now tells me that the largest risk portion is the 40 to 55 year old age bracket. The so called mid life crisis guys that just have to find some freedom. Regardless of bike size there is a price to pay for motorcycling and that is to learn as much as you can and to never stop learning. Bikes are a machine and you need to be a trained machine operator to handle it. Adrenalin is a major factor and we have to know how to control it. We all get a rush from our machines and this is the part that can hurt us. My wife can make every bike I have owned move, but she cannot ride (her words). She contests how she can squeeze my lifetime of knowledge into a short period of time. It's not just about making the bike move, it's about how you intend to ride it.

[funinaz]

I really appreciate everyones advice. My approach to this whole sport is slow and conservative. I like to do things right the best that I know how. I kind of feel like I'm between a rock and a hard place: beginners should start small and slow, but you also need something that you feel comfortable with.

Buying used initially has a lot of merit. Finding a decent inexpensive bike in my area is quite a challenge. Phoenix is a bikers meca. Riding is all year around. The classifieds are full of very expensive customs and slightly used bikes ( probably people who either didn't like to ride or are now upgrading having purchased a smaller bike ). I really don't wont to consider a much older bike as I don't know its history, or its condition. And since most of the slight used bikes sell for close to it not above MSRP on a new bike ( due to all of the customization ) its cheaper to by new. But buying new also has its advantages and disadvantages. If I buy new and small and upgrade then I take the depreciation hit ( I won't customize knowing that I'm going to upgrade the bike within a year ).

Anyway, I've still a lot of thinking to do, am in no big hurry, and after the MSF course might have a better feeling about my abilities and comfort levels.

Thanks all!

[flynrider]

There are used bikes in the phoenix area, you just have to look in the right places. I've been helping a buddy find a bike and we've had our best luck with online resources with searchable listings by region. Try :

http://www.cycletrader.com/

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/mcy/

[chris66]

thanks all, I have received a lot of good info from you guys and it will make my decision a little easier when I buy. I guess its going to come down to buy a bike thats easier to learn on or go for longevity. I dont have to worry about a payment because I'm paying cash, but I wont have the money to buy something else a year or 2 down the road. ( 3 teens seem to eat up extra cash quick) I figure if I start slow like you guys suggest I should be fine. I'm also real encouraged that zootech has stated several times that the vstar 1100 is forgiving enough for a beginner. So I'm kind of heading in that direction

[ZooTech]

I'm also real encouraged that zootech has stated several times that the vstar 1100 is forgiving enough for a beginner. So I'm kind of heading in that direction

That's a very good bike, and there is strong support from the aftermarket for it. The only gripe I have with my bro-in-law's is the seat, but that is true of pretty much every stock seat I have sat on since owning a Corbin and a Mustang.

What's really great is that there is a whole lot more performance waiting for you if you so choose, by adding some less restrictive slip-ons and a "Big-Air" kit. But, until you're ready for that, the stock output is smooth and plentiful, with no power peaks to surprise a beginner. Just be absolutely sure to go very slowly at first until low-speed maneuvers are a piece of cake, then graduate to higher speeds.

Keep us posted!

[bikeguy joe]

Good luck, be careful, stop here often.

I looked at the V-Star 650, but when I went back, they were closed on a Wed.! I went down the road to look at a Marauder, but I ended up loving the Volusia so much, I bought one. Glad I did, the 650 V was a bit small for me.

It's the first new bike I ever bought, now I ride it everyday, I have no car! I've had a zillion bikes, but this one is "my bike".