hello. If you think I'm going to die, let me know.

[onlystring]

Hello everyone.

I'm planning on purchasing a street bike soon and was hoping for some feedback.

I'm signed up for the MSF basic rider course and now I'm looking at bikes. I personally like the ex250. At first I thought it would be too small(I'm 6' 2" at 170 lbs), but I had a chance to sit on one for a while (at a kawi dealer) and I think it will work just fine. I'm not really looking for feedback on by bike choice, from what I've read around here this is a recommended starting bike anyway.

And now, before I pose my question to you people let me give you a little background. I am NOT rich, not even close, my dad is able to pay to feed me and put a roof over my head, and that's about it. I graduated from my high school last June a year early hoping to get a head start in my career (I've spent the last two years attending a trade school for half the day to become an auto mechanic). But Now I've found out that it's not legal to work as a mechanic when you are 17(insurance liability bla bla bla ......) so I have taken a job at a local supermarket working for $5.15 an hour at about 22 hrs a week. Unfortunately this is the only store willing to hire a minor within a realistic bicycling distance of my home. Like every typical teenager who is freed from school for the first time in their lives my overall goal is to move out and into my own place as soon as possible and work at a decent steady job(living in the real world if you want to put it that way). But my problem begins in the fact that I don't have the necessary first ingredient, a decent job. And without any form of transportation to other areas of possible employment it's going to stay that way.

So I decide I really need to buy a car. So I start saving, almost every penny of the $400 a month I make goes strait into a bank account and soon enough I hit the 2K mark (with the addition of money I had already saved from before) and decide to go shopping. I find a decent used Honda for $1700 and make plans to meet the seller the next day. Overjoyed with my perfect find I go on the net to find out just how much insurance is gonna cost for this thing, and that's where things go bad. I am a 17 year-old male driver with now previous driving record and a father with several 'DUI's on his record and no one willing to let me come in on their policy, and that sucks. The average quote I was able to find was about $1,700 a year for basic basic coverage. Ouch, but not to be deterred I wiped out my little calculator and figured out that worked out to be about $140 a month. I then continued to figure my other expenses in with this bill to find out how much money I would have left at the end of the month to start saving for an apartment.

$140 for insurance + around $150 for gas = $290 for a car

and now

$400 a month - $290 = $110 for saving and the rest of my life. It's not a whole lot, but at least it's something.

So far things are still doable, but here comes the kicker. As I was later to find out from a kindly sales rep at the insurance company the rate I was quoted was if a had paid in one lump sum, not if I paid only by monthly payments. Ok, how much more is it gonna cost to have them finance? Well, take a guess.............. give up? $263.18 per motherf****** month. At that rate I would actually be in debt every month, even with spending every penny I made. I was a little more than slightly angry at this point and spent the rest of the evening calling other companies hoping for that little ray of hope. But it never came. The lowest I was able to get was a little over $220 ( I didn't even bother writing it down at this point). Either way I simply could not afford to own a car. The next day I called up the seller of the Accord and told him something had come up and would no longer be able to come look at the car.

But then, after several night's of trying to find some way around this dilemma my mind suddenly flipped a stupid switch inside my head and I began to get some hope restored to my now disappearing goals. A motorcycle! I had a friend who rode a motorcycle and I remembered him telling me how cheap it was to run. First I looked for used to bikes in my local classifieds to see if there was even a market around here (in Mesa AZ) and to my luck there were a few cheap bikes that seemed perfect. My next step was to call up the same companies who had ruined my plans for independence just a few days ago. And to my surprise, they turned out to be saviors this time around. The first company I tried was progressive and I couldn't believe my ears when he told me that basic coverage would run me about $40 a month for the 1997 ninja 250r I saw in the paper. I had him double and triple check to make sure everything was right and then I laughed and hung up the phone. Lets do some more math.

$40 a month for insurance + probably $70 for gas at 50 mpg = $110 for a cycle

$400 - $110 = $290 to save and live with

Wow, that's a difference. And with transportation I would finally have the option to look for employment outside of my surrounding immediate neighborhood and get a decent paying job.

So my simple question to you is this,

Would you ever trust a person on a bike for their first 'car'? Or do you think I'm a fatalist and should look for another solution?

Thanks in advance for anything you feel like posting on the subject, and thanks for listening to my little rant. I enjoyed myself writing it. It felt good to organize my thoughts into a simple post.

EDIT:
I figured I should include a couple more things. First, I have had my drivers license since the day I turned 16. And Second, I'm fully aware of what a 'cage' can do to us squishy little humans. When I was 13 walking home from a friends house a drunk driver ran off the road and strait into me. I broke my left arm in 3 places, dislocated my leg from my hip a full 9 inches, and scraped almost all the skin off of my right forearm. The danger is not something I haven't considered.

[Loonette]

First off - Welcome aboard!!

Secondly - I feel for ya. I left school at 16, and by 17 I was totally on my own. In order to just get by I ended up having to share a home with my then boyfriend (now husband of 19 years) as well as with two-three other housemates. The basics in life start to seem like luxuries when you're young and poor. And there were many, many times that we drove without the required insurance on our vehicle because we just couldn't afford it. I wouldn't recommend doing this though - it will catch up to you. Anyway...

Motorcycles are cheaper as far as purchase price and gas usage, but if you'd like to have any protective gear, you'll have to make some sort of investment in that department. Also, you'll go through tires a bit quicker. Since you have mechanical abilities, I would say that that's a huge advantage to you. Maintenance and repairs on a bike are not cheap if you go to a shop, but you should be able to get through a repair manual without much difficulty.

Would you ever trust a person on a bike for their first 'car'? Or do you think I'm a fatalist and should look for another solution?

This question I don't fully understand. Well, I think that maybe I do a bit. You're young - albeit a responsible and mature person, still young - and I think you're just concerned about making a choice that will bite you in the arse in the end. There's no guarantee that this will work out for you, but there's no guarantee that it won't. I had wanted to ride since I was an 8-year-old, but didn't get around to it until I was 35. I lived in a snowbelt state, so using a motorcycle as a main form of transportation wasn't an option. Had it been, maybe I would have gotten into it sooner. I guess what I'm getting at is this - using a bike as your sole transportation is a reasonable idea in your situation, but I'm just hoping that you'll actually love riding.

You've come to the right place to get lots of opinions and information. Keep reading around, examine all the pros and cons of biking, and keep us posted. I don't think it's a crazy idea for you - you'll just have to make sure you've checked out all the aspects involved. Good luck!

Cheers,
Loonette

[Candy750]

Hi, Onlystring! I've been poor and on the wanting side myself. I graduated HS in 3 and a half years when I was 17, and wanted to be "away" from my parents in the worst way! I was once again poor and on the wanting side at 30, when I split from my exhusband, and left everything behind for my own sanity!!

You have one up on me - you have a very good career waiting for you once you are old enough! So, first, know it WILL get better.

Second, aren't there any auto parts or hardware stores in your area, that would put you behind the counter helping folks buy what they need? I have learned that employers pay for knowledge! Try to get into SOMETHING that will pay you for your smarts. If not, then be the best $5.15 worker ever, and hopefully they will see you are a good, hard worker and pay more!

I know some guys - now in their 40's - who got their bikes and bike licenses before driving a car. I bet if you take the course, start witha good foundation, you will be ok. If the MSF can teach me to ride, and safely too - they can teach you!! I think with your abilities, you'll find something in your affordable range, fix it up, maintain it yourself.

Last - remeber you are only young once. Don't let want fill your head with unhappiness.

[Bachstrad37]

Welcome to the board.

I think you're going to find some very valuable advice from some outstanding people here.

First off, I know what you're going through. I was extremely poor while attending college with no help from my sibblings or parents. We were all poor.

Second, I came to the U.S. from a third world country as a war refugee. We didn't have jack - running water, very little electricity, limited food, and all of us 9 kids supported our family business of fruit drink vendor. I came to the states with no knowledge of the English language - zero, zip. None of us did. We grinded our way through ESL classes (English Second Language). I was young and learned fast. I migrated to public schools within a couple of months (5th grade). Many kind Americans helped my family and I through open invitations for advice. I grew up and graduated at the 2% of my graduating class of 400 students.

Regardless, I was still poor. I worked at a local hospital's nutrition services department washing pots, pans, and dishing up food for patients during my HS years. Once I graduated from HS, I went to a private college because they offered me scholarships and worked in the cafeteria all four years. I was so poor, I ate lettuce. And when I got paid, I ate Mac and Cheese while I lived in the dorms with 3 guys. This all sounded bad, but it was luxury by my standards. If I wasn't here in the states, I'd be pitching water and working in the fields in Viet Nam.

My advice to you is - get the motorcycle. People all over the world has this or the bicycle as the only option. Heck, many have to walk! As bad as your situation sounds at the moment, it doesn't suck that bad. Hit the books and focus on your courses extensively. Know that it's going to be short term. There's sooooo many opportunities here in America. You have to overcome any lazy tendencies in the early stages. If you can stay focused on getting your automotive mechanic license, it's going to open up some big doors. Not only will you prosper, you'll enjoy everything because you earned everything you have. Food will taste better. You'll sleep better. Life is truly better.

[BLKNSLVR]

Hi Onlystring,

Welcome to the forum. You seem like an unusually mature and responsible young man for 17 and I compliment you on your writing skills. I think you have done more thinking this through than a lot of older adults do when it comes to this kind of thing.

The only warning for lack of a better term I would give is to be prepared to be rejected for certain jobs because a bike is your only form of transportation. I have been involved in the hiring process for many different kinds of businesses over the years and one of the things hiring managers really try to get to in a job interview is your reliability. Absenteeism is one of the biggest headaches for employers these days and while there are legal limits as to what they can ask you during the interview, there are subtle ways of getting you to disclose this information during a friendly conversation. Some employers are very anti-motorcycle and the AMA is currently fighting to prevent employers from excluding injuries sustained in a motorcycle accident from being covered in their benefit plans. You may run into a prospective employer who might be concerned that by using a motorcylce as your only means of transportation may mean that you will be calling in absent on bad weather days. Not fair, I know, but unfortunately it is a fact of life.

Good luck in your endeavors. I was very impressed with your post.

Greg

[Shiv]

Man, tough times.

But , we're glad to have ya!


I'm glad that you've already read the stickies and the like and have picked a good first bike to start on. It'll get you many miles per the gallon too.


You might try calling other insurance companies as well. $40/month seems a bit low to me, especially since you're 17 and male. I'm 19 and male and the insurance companies want to take both my arms, my left leg, and the femur from the right.

But I want a GS/EX500 so it's a bit different.

Anyhow as loonette said you might want to save that 200 or so a month for gear for a bit. You can get a good helmet (Scorpion EXO 700) for around 200 dollars, a good jacket for the same price, and gloves for about 70. Pants are about 100 or so and boots $20 or so for leather combat boots from a military surplus store (the route I plan to take).

For, as you said, humans are squishy.

[torxim]

look into HJC helmets, and in terms of gear, just try and find some used gear on craigslist or the likes. you'll save quite a bit doing so

[CNF2002]

What about a scooter? The insurance must be cheaper for something that isn't really freeway capable, but it would give you plenty of go around town to and from work.

[jrdudas]

Welcome Onlystring,

I started riding a Vespa motorscooter legally at age 14 in Florida. Didn't get my auto license until I was 16. I don't know if it is still this way in Florida, but back in the day you could be licensed for scooters and bikes that were below a certain horsepower at age 14. I would not worry about riding a bike before owning a car; just be aware that you always must assume that every other vehicle on the road intends to hit you. Your driving must be highly defensive at all times. Things happen quickly on a bike and even the smallest incident can be very serious.

With that said, I'll suggest something that I have not seen mentioned so far. I know you probably don't want to hear this, but give serious consideration to continuing your education. As someone else mentioned, I can see that you have good writing skills and I expect that you were a pretty good student in school. I trained as an auto mechanic at a technical high school many years ago and ran in to some of the same problems you are experiencing now. I graduated from high school at age 17 and could not buy a job as a mechanic. I widened my job search and wound up at a large retailer only to get laid off after a few months with my supervisor's apology. He said my work was way more than satisfactory, but they had to cut staff and I was lowest in seniority.

In those days one of the first questions a potential employer asked was "is your military service completed"? As a result I decided to join the Army and I do not regret that decision; it was the right thing for me. I'm not suggesting that for you, but I am suggesting that you consider higher education. There's nothing wrong with being a mechanic; most of the mechanics I know make a good living. But higher education will give you many more opportunities in life. I'll make a long story short and relate how after 26 years of service in the telephone industry I got laid off and dumped on the street. I had a wife and two kids to support and very few places where I could take my skill and hope to earn anywhere near what I had been making. That's when I started taking college classes in earnest. I now have a two year degree in Social Sciences and am eight classes away from my 4 year degree. It has been a tremendous amount of work to take classes and maintain my family responsibilities, but it's worth it. I am much older than you, but one item of advice I give to anyone who will listen is to get as much education as you can. The employers and big corporations in this world can take everything away from you; but they can never take away your education.

Good luck in whatever you decide,

JR

[MikeyDude]

My response will be a little different than some of the others. I'm old, so I look at things differently... lol.

My suggestion is to be patient. There is really no reason to be in such a hurry to move out of the house and get on you're own. If you think transportation is expensive, wait til you get an apartment and have to deal with deposits, furniture, electricity, gas, water & garbage, telephone and food, and still have the expense of transportation. Stay home for a little while longer and build up that bank account. I know what it's like to want to get out, but once you're out you're on your own. As far as I know, the most you'll have to have in the way of insurance is liability on a car. This is far cheaper than on a bike. Tires are cheaper too, and if worse things come to worse...

...You can always sleep in the car (been there, done that).

A bike is good reasonably cheap transportation (except in winter), but sooner or later you'll need a car. Take your time and stay home a little longer. You've got a long road ahead of you, so there's no need to hurry into traffic.

.02