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Latest "school shooting" scare
Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 2:14 am
by mgdavis
I'm watching MSNBC, and they just showed a story about a potential school shooting that was averted. I missed what city it was in, but it's the case where authorities apparently jailed the boy's mother for buying him guns. One of the main camera shots was a pan over a table full of guns. I's like to point out that, as far as I have been able to find out, there was one firearm on that table. The rest were airsoft and bb guns. The real one was a Hipoint carbine, the ugly black rifle right at the end of the table.
I'm not trying to downplay this incident at all, just trying to add some perspective to the media coverage. The 30 plus weapons were mostly toys, it irritates me that the media attempts to make it appear that this kid had several AKs, etc. :spin:
Follow-up
Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 2:32 am
by mgdavis
The second time they ran this, their expert or on site guy did state that most of the guns were "realistic looking". I managed to miss where it was again, might have been Indiana. Kid was home schooled, if that helps narrow it down.
Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 4:54 am
by Scoutmedic
It was in Plymouth Township, Montgomery County, Pennsylvania near Philadelphia. Here's a link to news footage:
http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?secti ... id=5701761
Posted: Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:20 am
by Loonette
I'm sorry, but if my kid was depressed and left public school because he was being bullied too much, the last thing I would do is buy him guns! The kid needed some counseling at the very least. Let's see... a .22 caliber handgun, a .22 caliber rifle, and a 9 mm semi-automatic rifle. That alone is some serious business. And since when are homemade grenades not a big deal?! And BB guns are not toys - they can pierce the skull quite easily if aimed well. Acting as though this kid was harmless and that the mother has no responsibility is just asking for another school shooting, IMHO. Thank goodness someone had the wisdom and guts to speak up.
Loonette
Re: Latest "school shooting" scare
Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 1:47 pm
by Shorts
mgdavis wrote:I'm watching MSNBC, and they just showed a story about a potential school shooting that was averted. I missed what city it was in, but it's the case where authorities apparently jailed the boy's mother for buying him guns. One of the main camera shots was a pan over a table full of guns. I's like to point out that, as far as I have been able to find out, there was one firearm on that table. The rest were airsoft and bb guns. The real one was a Hipoint carbine, the ugly black rifle right at the end of the table.
I'm not trying to downplay this incident at all, just trying to add some perspective to the media coverage. The 30 plus weapons were mostly toys, it irritates me that the media attempts to make it appear that this kid had several AKs, etc. :spin:
Just typical media , both you and I know that from being around firearms and the firearm community for so long.
Unfortunately, Sheeple do listen to anything the media sensationalizes, especially on topics and activities of which they have no absolute first hand practical experience, education or training.
The way the media and society goes these days, motorcycles = guns
Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2007 3:29 pm
by dr_bar
No offence, but there was more than just one "REAL" gun there. Yes there were a bunch of air powered weapons, but a 9mm semi-automatic rifle isn't needed by any 14yr old. The bomb making book and supplies are also a bit of a give away when combined with the Columbine movie and the Anarchists cookbook.
"The weapons included a 9mm semiautomatic rifle that the teenager's mother had recently bought for him, Montgomery County District Attorney Bruce L. Castor Jr. said. Prosecutors are reviewing her actions.
Police also found about 30 air-powered guns, plus swords, knives, hand grenades, a bomb-making book, videos of the 1999 Columbine attack in Colorado and violence-filled notebooks, Castor said. The weapons were plainly visible in the boy's bedroom, Castor said.
Also discovered were seven explosive devices Castor described as homemade grenades: plastic containers filled with BBs to which gunpowder could be added. Authorities said one grenade was operable and the others had been in the process of being assembled.
The search did not turn up any ammunition for the most dangerous firearm in the bunch, the assault rifle."
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 3:51 am
by Shorts
A 9mm Hi Point carbine. Cheap to buy ~ $200 new. We had one, and as crappy as the quality was, it shot pretty dang straight.
What model exactly is "the assault rifle"? Are they referring to Hi Point??
Wow, the ignorance of many is hard to overcome. And 9mm rounds aren't hard to come by so you don't really nee dthem on hand (but most dedicated owners are well stocked). Go to walmart. Oh wait, even they hassle responsible owners about buying ammunition and accessories...between certain times of the day...carding...and so on. Not like there are not stop-gaps in place
Just a little FYI for non- gun owners, "semi-automatic" is the action in which pretty much all modern firearms (handguns and some rifles & shotguns) are built with. So, "semi-auto" is not really any kind of menacing term. You're just telling people who know what it is that you have no idea what "semi-auto" is but it sounds dangerous and menacing so you can use it to describe the pistol. In fact, mention any pistol by name and any educated firearms enthusiast can tell you the action, whether its single(SA), traditional double action (SA/DA capabilities) or double action only (DAO)...and it'll be a given that the pistol will be "semiauto". Any pistol or gun that's been converted to auto fire is in fact, illegal.
All automatic arms are prohibited unless you had a Class III license (expensive and red tape involved). Now if someone is reported having one of those, then you can raise some eyebrows. In fact, autos are just downright interesting whether its the good guy or the bad guy who has them!
Below sounds pretty confusing, but go get educated on how to use one and actually spend time shooting/handling different makes and models and this makes sense.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_firearm
semi-automatic firearm is a gun that requires only a trigger pull for each round that is fired, unlike a single-action revolver, a pump-action firearm, a bolt-action firearm, or a lever-action firearm, which require the shooter to manually chamber each successive round. For example, to fire ten rounds in a semi-automatic firearm, the trigger would need to be pulled ten times (once for each round fired), in contrast to a fully automatic firearm, which can continue to fire as long as the trigger is held or until it runs out of ammunition.
There are semi-automatic pistols, rifles, and shotguns. A semi-automatic mode is a common choice on selective fire firearms. Firearms capable of firing bursts of more than one round (usually three) per pull of the trigger, such as the M16A2 rifle, are considered fully automatic.
A double-action revolver also requires only a trigger pull for each round that is fired but is not considered semi-automatic. The difference in a double-action revolver is that the act of pulling the trigger also rotates the cylinder moving the next round into position. Semi-automatic function uses the recoil force generated by the last fired cartridge combined with spring action in the firearm to ready the next round to be fired.
The usage of the term automatic may vary according to context. Gun specialists point out that the word automatic is sometimes misunderstood to mean fully automatic fire when used to refer to a self-loading, semi-automatic firearm not capable of fully automatic fire. In this case, automatic refers to the loading mechanism, not the firing capability.
The term "automatic pistol" almost exclusively refers to a semi-automatic (i.e. not fully automatic) pistol. With handguns, the term "automatic" is commonly used to distinguish semi-automatic pistols from revolvers. The term "auto-loader" may also be used to describe a semi-automatic handgun. However, the term "automatic rifle" may mean a rifle capable of fully automatic fire. Both uses of the term "automatic" can be found, and the exact meaning must be determined from context.
The mechanism of semi-automatic (or auto-loading) firearms is usually what is known as a closed bolt firing system. In a closed-bolt system, a round must first be chambered manually before the weapon can fire. When the trigger is pulled, only the hammer and firing pin move, striking and firing the cartridge. The bolt then recoils far enough rearward to extract and load a new cartridge from the magazine into the firearm's chamber, ready to fire again once the trigger is pulled.
An open bolt mechanism is a common characteristic of fully automatic firearms. With this system, pulling the trigger releases the bolt from a cocked, rearward position, pushing a cartridge from the magazine into the chamber, firing the gun. The bolt retracts to the rearward position, ready to strip the next cartridge from the magazine. The open-bolt system is often used in submachine guns and other weapons with a high rate of fire. It is rarely used in semi-automatic-only firearms, which can fire only one shot with each pull of the trigger. The closed-bolt system is generally more accurate, since the center of gravity changes relatively little at the moment the trigger is pulled.
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 8:07 am
by scan
I get your feeling about gun ownership and safety, but to those of us who think having a gun is not a requisite for living or even living safely, it seems like a bad idea to give one to a kid. Now I am fully aware that there is an arguement that says we have a right to bare arms in the US. And that if guns were not legal, that only outlaws would have the weapons too. But for me I would rather not have a gun around my kids, and I wouldn't want to have to make that choice in the dark with a prowler in my house. Maybe I'd feel different of something happened to my family, but I guess I'd want someone besides the upset person I'd become to make the decisions. Calmer heads should prevail. Acting as a vicious person in return for vicious behaviour hardly seems civilized, nor does it seem morally correct.
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:26 am
by dr_bar
Forget I mentioned guns... Does a 14 yr old need bombs???
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:44 am
by Loonette
I'm not sure why everyone's getting all bent out of shape about "gun ownership rights". That's not what the original post was about. The OP, while saying he isn't downplaying the event, is sort of downplaying it by saying that the weapons found weren't that serious of guns.
A lot of the guns found were toys and/or BB guns that this kid had been collecting for a long time. It's no wonder that authorities found them in his home. But just recently... because he had left public school for being teased too much... his mother bought him the more serious weapons as a way to indulge him and make him feel better. That should not be downplayed at all. Nor should the fact that the mother had no idea that her kid was making bombs and attempting to recruit another kid to help him carry out his plot.
Own your guns if you like. I've been to a shooting range with a friend and learned a bit about guns. Nobody here mentioned "semi automatic" because that sounded dangerous - that's just what the gun is called. So thanks for the education on guns, but it's not really the issue here. The fact that he had any gun in his quietly-depressed-sociopathic possession is more than enough to raise my eyebrow. And I can bet you that if your child was killed by someone like this, then you too would want to hold the mother accountable for giving his these weapons.
The original post(er) was trying to say that the media had made a bigger deal about this than what was there. I disagree. He had enough weapons and enough resentment to do a lot of damage to a lot of lives. I'll say it again - I'm glad that someone spoke up so that we didn't have to hear another story about another school shooting.
Loonette