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Here's a typical example of George Bush's complete neglect of one of the main reasons why terrorists hate America so much:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/21/inter ... deast.html

"With this settlement building, and the wall that is being built, the question for President Bush is: What is left to be negotiated?"

woops let me try a different link there

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/News ... 47,00.html

Terrorists hate Americans for their economic imperialism and willingness to subjugate entire nations in order to protect their economic interests.

Israel is just one of the many flashpoints for that anger to take root. There would still be terrorism without Israel. It's true, though, provocations like this sure don't help. Americans on the whole are generally stupid about the world in general. Many never get a glimpse of world news ... preferring instead quicks soundbites and glossovers. The Jackson trial is much more important. As American greed drives American Imperialism, it's doubtful that the root cause of terrorism will be eliminated. After all, our politicians, Bankers, and corporate leaders are the greediest, and they are the ones who dictate our foreign policy. Even if, by some graceful miracle, the majority of Americans actually educated themselves on the real issues shaping their world, nothing would change. The Imperialist attitude is too deeply ingrained in the 'Corporatocracy' for any meaningful change to take place. Another Bush would win another doubtful election, and so it would go on.

Anyway, as OLDNSLO says, IT'S ABOUT OIL, MONEY, AND POWER, ALL OF THE TIME. Israel's just a side issue.

kinda reminds a guy of what happened to the Roman empire in the final years, doesn't it?

IMHO: That Isreally wall is aweful. It is a horrible thing to build and to justify it and ignore the International illegality of it is .... unthinkable.

Walls, virtual or real are no way to settle a dispute of any kind.

This Isreal wall makes me think that Isreal has on intention of ever having a peaceful relationship with its neighbours. Do you really think they are going to tear down this 300km+ wall after a year...?

Mike.

There have been many comparisons made over the years between the declining morality and societal quality of the US and Rome, as it neared its own end. The similarities are incredibly strong, and nobody seems to be noticing, which is odd, in light of our newly rediscovered sense of values as described in recent months by the media. One would think there would be much more interest in the decline and destruction of our society. Perhaps the people who will inhabit the country at the end are too busy with the financial details of opening a chain of adult video stores, or checking out new sources for cocaine, or maybe plotting ways to wipe out business competitors, or dealing with that annoying secretary who is now pregnant, screwing employees out of their retirement, or simply making money by hook or crook, no matter who gets stomped or destroyed along the way.
But then, again, maybe things can go on this way, declining, for a very long time before flash point occurs. It probably won't get much attention until it's nearly over, just like in the case of Rome.

News flash.

When the wall wasn't there bombers kept sneaking in and killing civilians. Second we haven't subjugated anyone. Give an actual example if your going to make a comment like that.

If anything the U.S. has done the opposite. We rebuilt germany and japan then left. Never asking for one cent back. Every time a disaster happens we give more money than just about anyone. And I don't include pledges as donations. We are in control of Iraq but letting them form their own government and police and military force, oh yeah we are training them at our expense by the way. So how are do we subjugate people?

There have been jokes for years about poor countries declaring war on the US just for all the post-war benefits via our willingness to cheerfully rebuild, with massive improvements, any country we vanquish. We are generous to a fault in this respect, and often leave gold-plated condos where tin-covered shacks once stood.
Everybody plays on our misplaced concience, working hard to make us feel guilty, or at least responsible, for any catastrope, natural or otherwise, in the world.
Remember all the negative comments when George initially pledged "only" 15 million in disaster aid for the big tsunami? George responded with pledges of billions of our money. That's nice, but billions in disaster aid + trillions to the wars we're in does start adding up after awhile. I bet there are a few people right here in the good 'ol USA who could use a few bucks right now.

jjhotrods wrote:News flash.

When the wall wasn't there bombers kept sneaking in and killing civilians. Second we haven't subjugated anyone. Give an actual example if your going to make a comment like that.

If anything the U.S. has done the opposite. We rebuilt germany and japan then left. Never asking for one cent back. Every time a disaster happens we give more money than just about anyone. And I don't include pledges as donations. We are in control of Iraq but letting them form their own government and police and military force, oh yeah we are training them at our expense by the way. So how are do we subjugate people?

First off, the US has at least 3000 miles of ocean on its east and west, and two friendly countries to the north and south (If you think we can trust those sneaky Canadians ) Much more substantial than a silly little wall, eh? Yet terrorists still got in. A wall isn't going to solve anything - and it certainly won't stop a dedicated bomber. It's just another creative way to avoid the real issue.

Second, US foreign policy doesn't end at Germany and Japan. Lest you forget, at the same time America was funnelling dollars into these two countries, it was busy with Britain and Russia completely displacing an entire nation of people and moving another nation of people in to take their place Oh wait, I'm sorry, that's not subjugation ... it's worse.

Subjugation doesn't mean 'military domination.' It means 'to bring under the yoke ... to subdue or cause to become subservient.
Subjugation can be through many controls. The most prevalent today is economic subjugation. Billions of US Dollars funneled into the World bank for the purpose of paying off dictatorial or corrupt regimes in the form of loans for massive public works projects. The loans are only made by the US Government on the condition that US Multinational firms purchase privatized industry and take over the infrastructure of the entire country. Therefore, the regime is made richcer, the corporations get their contracts, and the public is made to pay for the burden of the cooperative greed of the regime and the US Government.

And in case you think that's just fluff (not really subjugation) here's some good old fashioned iron fist type of stuff.

MILITARY, POLITICAL, ECONOMIC COERSION
attempt to support or create regimes subservient to our will, Including:
- selling WMD to totalitarian regimes like Iraq
- Supporting Military Coups in Direct opposition to the democratic will of a nation ex, Haiti (Aristide)
- Supporting Terrorism (The School of the Americas, Panama)

Well. Who needs a list here? Korea, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, Colombia, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Honduras .... etc etc. have all been subjugated to our will at one time or another.

POLITICAL Subjugation (US Funded assasinations)
Patrice Lumumba (Congo)
Rafael Trujillo (Dominican Republic)
Ngo Dihn Diem (Vietnam)
Salvador Allende (Chile)

POLITICAL Subjugation (US Funded Dictatorships)
Manual Noriega (Panama)
Saddam Hussein (Iraq)
Rafael Trujillo (Dominican Republic)
(Among many others)

Who excactly was being misplaced?

Yes you are correct the U.S. has had its hand in many regretable situations.

But here is why I find disagreement with you. In just about all cases the U.S. did so on the basis that those individuals/countries would be U.S. friendly and not plot against us. Yes in hinsight we can look back and find fault with just about every decision a government has made. The question that one must ask I think in relation to the event of the time is what was the rational behind the decision. In most cases it was a matter of the lesser of two evils I believe. A decision was made that we were creating an opprotunity to better a bad situation. And yes people are greedy and those with power are more so. But to label the U.S. as such and pin blame soley on us is wrong I believe regardless of the country.

My irritaion with the comment of subjication is that it assumes the cause is greed and power on the part of the country.

When in most cases the course of action taken was done in what was believed to be in the national interest of this country. And yes financial security is as important as military security.