Total Motorcycle Community Forums

It seems that our M.L.A.s are considering implementing a graduated licence program for motorcyclists in Alberta. The quote that I read in the paper was something along the lines of "too many young people getting killed on high-powered bikes" and "outta the 9 bike fatalities in the province this year, 6 were on high powered bikes" ....AND " we want to look at something like they have in the U.K. where you have to start out on 125cc"......
THIS scares me to a certain degree now that we are about to embark over this slippery slope. I'm not a fan of a 16 year old kid on a gixxer but how how long will it be before our M.L.A.s determine that these bikes are too much for old guys too???? Not long, I'm thinking....
Ideally, there would be a rational limit on what you could ride for the first couple of years, but 125cc does not constitute a safe bike on the praries or in the mountains. There is alot of open road here and on the majority of it only 125cc would get you killed.....IMHO
I'm guessing that this should re-open that big ol' can of worms.....

Let's hope they at least opt for 250 cc's.

I believe the Aussies are limited to 250cc's for a year or two. Much better limitation than 125cc for sure!

I was reading on a V-star forum that they are limited not by size, but by horsepower over in the UK. They have officially fitted restricters for the first two years. Supposedly, these restricters are basically something that goes under the carbs to restrict the final throat size. I think the restriction is 33 HP. This allows riders requiring big bikes to get them, but ride them "officially limited to 33 HP". It also allows you to get one bike, learn on it restricted and then graduate to non-restriction in two years without having to upgrade to a larger bike at that time. But personally, I'm not convinced that this is good for the larger bikes. The person on the V-star forum was complaining about poor economy, probably caused by the restricters.

Here in WA state, we used to be limited to 250cc's for the first year or two. You had to get a 250cc endorsement, ride on that for a while, then retest for a larger cc endorsement. Or something like that. It was way before my riding time in this state, thank ye Gods...

I guess government just feels they have to protect those with no common sense from themselves. I prefer to see it as another form of natural selection. Everyone's got a brain in their head, some decide not to use it.

There were similar fears here in Ontario before they went to graduated licensing, but in the end they decided that HP or engine size restriction was too hard to set up and enforce and they went after the rider instead. So what started out as a good idea ended up as a farce:

M1 (learner's) level: All you have to do is pass a written test and you get your licence. That means a 16 yr old can get the Gixxer of his dreams if daddy is willing to pay the obscene insurance rates at this level. Restrictions are that you cannot ride after dark, cannot carry a passenger, you must avoid the 400 series highways (all 4-lane superhighways) and maintain a zero blood alcohol level while riding. If you get caught doing anything stupid at the M1 level your licence is usually suspended - and just try and get a decent insurance quote when it's reinstated!

M2 (intermediate): Within 90 days of getting your M1 you can upgrade to an M2. This can be done by passing a written and practical test at a driver's examination center or by taking and successfully completing a Canada Safety Council "Gearing Up" course, usually offered at your local college. Pretty much all of the insurance companies here offer substantial discounts if you take the CSC course, in fact the insurance savings usually pay for the course and more. When I was a CSC instructor it was not uncommon to see younger riders save $1,500 EVERY YEAR because of the course. Anyway, all the M1 restrictions are then removed except for the zero blood alcohol level. You can renew the M2 permit every year for a maximum of 5 years; if you don't upgrade to an M within that time frame then you get dumped back to the M1 level and start all over again.

M (fully licenced): After a minimum of 18 months at the M2 level you can upgrade to M by taking another test at the driver center or another course at the local college. Taking the course doesn't result in any insurance discount this time, though. The zero blood alcohol level restriction is removed and you're legal to drink and ride up to the 0.08% limit as defined by law.

Canadian Governmental Action at it's finest......

Gummiente wrote:There were similar fears here in Ontario before they went to graduated licensing, but in the end they decided that HP or engine size restriction was too hard to set up and enforce and they went after the rider instead. So what started out as a good idea ended up as a farce:

Now I really wanna know how that has turned out for them. I'd bet that there are no squids wheelying through school zones anymore The stats after Ontario made the switch would really be interesting...

High_Side wrote: Now I really wanna know how that has turned out for them. I'd bet that there are no squids wheelying through school zones anymore

You'd lose that bet. They're still out there, but maybe not as prolific as they used to be. A more common occurence is to try and run from the cops now because if they're caught the resulting fine and insurance hike will keep them off the road permanently.

Gummiente wrote:

High_Side wrote: Now I really wanna know how that has turned out for them. I'd bet that there are no squids wheelying through school zones anymore

You'd lose that bet.

I was kidding...

High_Side wrote: I was kidding...

Ah. Wasn't sure what context that smiley was to be taken, but I hadn't taken offence to it or been even mildly annoyed. Damned internet. Anyway, I'm with you on wanting to see the stats since Ontario went to this system but I don't think the results would be accurate because we've also been getting screwed over on insurance rates these last few years. Many companies now just flat out refuse to insure them and in Ontario there are only five companies left that will - State Farm (but oh, man, you had better have a clean record), Kingsway, Jevco, The Personal and Primmum. Sales of new bikes here have slumped because most people simply cannot afford the insurance; in a lot of cases the monthly insurance payment is more than the monthly loan payment.

But at least we're not as bad as our brothers and sisters in Manitoba - you wouldn't believe some of the rates there.

I would be in favor of it depending on how it is limited and imposed. The current graduated licencing in Alberta is not very good at all for new riders.

250-500cc would be good because there are not many 250cc bikes forsale in Canada and under 500cc would open up a lot of styles of bikes to new riders. Or, rather than engine size, maybe horsepower/torque maximums or combination of both.

The Alberta government really needs to keep it simple with this one to be fully effective.

Mike.