The few creating a problem for the rest of us...

[Shorts]

Taking the issue personally and attacking someone are two different things.


Understanding of the English and its vast phrases and words often elude you.

I'm referring to how you got all twitchy with the "post reply" button at the start of the thread. So, I'm not going to sit here and split nose hairs with you anyway. You don't understand what people try to tell you, so no. Like Sev said in another post, you're the only one on the internet that can give a migraine.

[jstark47]

Someone mentioned closing the roads for a time so bikers can make a run. While I think it'd be fun, I still see accidents being an issue. Sure the complains will receed for a bit but I think get enough folks out there at one time cramming in rides and maybe racing and wagering (like you know would end up happening), there'd still be problems with "people getting killed". Emergency services and those kinds of resources would still be taxed. I imagine that may be an issue that doesn't sit right with somebody in the little towns. Again, I think that idea of a specific bikes only time would be fun, but new problems would arise.

Reading this something clicked - there was an article in the AMA magazine about a place with a private road that's open once a year. Turns out it's the Sportsbike Northwest event, and they have access to a private road that runs up the Columbia River gorge.

Hey, Verm.... that's your side of the continent. Save up your pennies!

[VermilionX]

Hey, Verm.... that's your side of the continent. Save up your pennies!

that's cool.

im not really practical but for all the money i'd spend for that... i could get some serious tracktime instead.

maybe if i get jaded from the tracks, i'll look into that again.

[isnowbrd]

I found this thread about 7 pages too late. But here's my opinion. This problem reminds me too much of helmet laws. I personally don't think we need the government trying to protect ourselves from ourselves. Intead they should be trying to protect ourselves from other people. For the most part, it sounds like these bikers are hurting themselves more than other people. Although they did give one example of a bicyclist that was injured. If occurrences like that are happening, law enforcement needs to have more of a presence on those roads. Tickets and impounds will slow these squids down.

I just don't like all the hype about them killing themselves. That entire story should have only focused on people that were injured by the bikers, not on bikers that hurt themselves.

[ZooTech]

If you've got an opinion regarding bikes going too fast and out of control on twisty public roads, then state it, otherwise step back and shut up.

Sure thing. Notice the "poor old store owner" who is "terrorized" by these street thugs every day? How well do you think his business would be doing if the area wasn't a hang out for motorcyclists? For a number of years now Mansfield, Ohio has held an annual event called the "Miracle Mile" that attracts motorcyclists and hot-rodders from miles around. Word was given to cone-off several blocks of the city and to relax police enforcement and allow a certain amount of rowdiness to take place. All in all it brought tons of business and thousands of dollars to the local economy. But this year someone got a stick in their hole and the police came down on everyone. The event was halted and it sounds like it may be moved to another nearby town with a penchant towards revenue and recognition. In any case, if you turn the Blue Ridge Mountains into a militarized zone it will scare away everyone but retirees driving RV's cross country.

Furthermore, that news story was a perfect example of editing and biased journalism in an attempt to add drama to statistics that aren't that difficult to understand. If I were to look through the police files in South Dakota for the week of the Sturgis Bike Rally, it would appear as though all hell was breaking loose on the roads up there. In reality, when an event or destination draws an inordinate number of motorcyclists you're going to end up with the statistics shown in that news clip. It's the classic "majority of accidents happen within a mile of home" misconception that plagues anyone incapable of independant thought. So the only "problem" with The Loop is that it freakin' rules.

What SHOULD be done?

Well, we could all live by the Bible, but that certainly would't be any fun.

What CAN be done?

Nothing. Stay in Maryland. Somewhere in Baltimore there's an oppressed woman that needs you!

[CNF2002]

My personal opinion of anyone driving/riding above 5+ the speed limit as completely unacceptable is probably overkill...but going 20+ over (please correct the specific number if needed), which these bikers are, is a federal offense.

I agree also with showing up at the persons house with an officer and a flatbed. That's probably the safest option.

Somewhere in Baltimore there's an oppressed woman that needs you!

[offtopic]Now you sound like my wife. She's always grumbling when I start on about some men's rights issue.[\endofftopic]

[Sev]

Okay so, before I say any of this

1) I couldn't get the video to play

Whoops.

Anyways, double yellows are layed out with the greatest possible margin of safety for passenger vehicles. This means that you'll only get a passing lane where there's a long enough line of site for a slower moving passenger vehicle (minivan, truck etc) to safely make a pass. A motorcycle with its lighter weight and better acceleration can in some cases safely make a pass in a double yellow section.

This does not make it less illegal. But that doesn't mean it is always as reckless as some people seem to think.




Skipping past that, it takes one bad apple to spoil the bunch, and there is no difference in bikes to the minds of the public. All bikes/bikers pretty much fall into one of three categories. Harleys (and look alikes), Crotch Rockets, and Goldwings (and look alikes). When a "crotch rocket" ends up on TV, it isn't for going slow, so all crotch rockets go WAY to fast on the street. Harley's are involved in illegal motorcycle clubs. And touring bikes just don't show up...or they don't seem too.

I'd say something stupid like we should all just obey the rules of the road, but that'll never happen. I DO wish that trackdays were cheaper, and that there were more options, but that's pretty unlikely too. So what can we do? Increase enforcement and put tougher restrictions on licensing. A news story about a biker doing double the speed limit encountering a spike belt might inspire some people to slow down.



How fast does everyone typically go on the highway?
Personally I'll do 20-30 over (kmh) on the highway, and 5-10 in residential/slower areas. That has me passing fairly often, but still being passed myself on the highway, and at the same speed as traffic in town.

As for Posted Speed Limits. Around here if it's white background it's the law. Yellow background is a suggested speed limit (I tend to ignore those ones).



Oh an Verm, Zoo seems to subscribe to the Ad Hominem school of debate. It can be remarkably effective, especially in front of crowds, but is generally looked down upon.

[JC Viper]

Yeah well I ended up getting a nice ticket and a court date for running from someone who felt it was a good idea to follow me really close. When I do follow the "rules" I have people follow me and refuse to pass, or they pass at me by going over the double yellow only to slow down in front of me.

In this city since people refuse to see you I end up having to go 10 over the limit (30) just to prevent any rear enders from speeding taxis or "gangsters" in large ford SUVs.

I refuse to be called a felon.

Once I can afford a car then I can disregard bikers and not get in trouble for it since it's popular in focusing on bikers as menaces. Sure the report says it's only a few bike regular joes will think anyone on a bike is doing it.

ahh it's good to vent.

[VermilionX]

Oh an Verm, Zoo seems to subscribe to the Ad Hominem school of debate. It can be remarkably effective, especially in front of crowds, but is generally looked down upon.

again... where did i attack someone in this thread?

i didn't do such a thing.

but i dunno, my head's been busted open 3 times already so maybe it's catching up to me.

so quote it for me pls to refresh my memory.

ok thanks bye.

[TR7]

I agree that this report was biased. Its only because these "angels" who drive the speed limit and below are the most vocal group that this problem exists. They are probably the same ones that use their cars imense size to run me off the road, use the left turning lane as a straight lane, force me out of my lane, hold me up, give them exclusive rights to run a stop sign ect. so I have no pitty if someone crashes through their windshield. Just think of what would happen if the sportbike rider was the louder voice? "Were all crashing on our favorite roads because of all these cagers in minivans that we have to dodge!" or if someone looked at it like "it seems like motorcycles are crashing into cars so the obvious solution is to get rid of the cars." Its the same thing. they act like none of the cars ever crossed the line into a motorcyclists path into another lane and killed them, or crashed going around a turn to fast. Either way the problem wont be fixed with more fines more police mo speed cameras or impounding. The tigher you get on people, the more angry they get and the dumber they act. Do you like chocolate chip cookies? Well the gov't has come to the decision that because they cause obesity your only alowed to have one a year. but you have every right to that cookie. Let the sportbikes have their fun, in reality (excluding the speed laws fr a second) they have every right to go up into those mountains and kill themselves. Just because other people dont enjoy it or they dont approve the solution is to ban it somehow. I say ban fishing, everywhere, because I dont enjoy fishing so I dont care about them, and when people are fishing i cant swim. There was noting in that film that said the motorcyclists were causing major harm to those people of the area, yes a bicyclist was hit (the most worst thing i saw) but she was alive and well, and it could have happened if a car was going to fast also, so i find that quite irrelivent. In reality i dont thing this is a probelm of the sportbiker or the citizens of the area, this is a problem of society in "i am always right and i have full rights to be here damn everyone else!" its these frustrations that cause motorcyclists to not give cagers the courtesy to give them a chance to let them by, but it goes the same with a cager. they cant just say "thats speeding, thats wrong and im going to take it personally and hold them up" they need to see that we enjoy going about those mountains fast just as we need to see and respect them and the fact that they dont. And this goes for all parts of the road. If we can just give the little courtosey to understand people and let them go about as they please we would have alot less problems. because its aloso that guy in the SUV in the left lane doing 50 and not ley anyone pass that causes the guy in the pickup to cut off the stationwagon full of girlscouts to get around the guy and consiquently run the wagon into the ditch where it explodes in a huge fireball. obviously because the person in the SUV was obeying the law, despite not being able to display any common courtesy, he had nothing to do with this. Hes just as bad as the guy in the pickup. If they can forgive me fore speeding once in a while, ill forgive them for cutting me off once i na while.
Or an alternateive solution to the solving the problem with understanding and couresy method is to divert attention to others. So if we want the motorcyclist to get a better image, we gotta make some bad images on others. And I have a genious plan for this, we all gotta buy minivans, we can paint them up all black with skulls and stuff. Itll be great! Then we gotta terrorize people in them, im not talking about bumping inot people at stoplights, I mean run busses full of nuns off bridges and plow through schoolyards full of children! Give this a month and well see how many people complain about motorcycles being a terror after that! HA!