Question for Harley riders

[Telesque]

Well, I'll say this much: Gummiente owns a Harley, and says they're alright. And he seems like a pretty reasonable guy, so I'll take that to heart.

As far as the engine revving goes: Sport bike engines (can) go up to 14,000 RPM. Cruisers usually stay down around 9,000 (or under, yes?)

So, even if you didn't consider gearing (which is the most important thing in determing which engine speed relates to which bike speed) you'd still have to consider that a sport bike engine is revving /way/ higher than a cruiser in most situations.

[Gummiente]

One thing that was consistent about the Harley is that they require a lot of maintenance and not very reliable; this is from 5 existing Harley owners. They listed several issues related to vibration, valve adjustments, etc...

What year are their bikes? Harleys have had hydraulic lifters for many years now - there's no such thing as "valve adjustments" with them anymore. As for vibration issues, most of Harley's lineup has rubber mounted motors for several years, the ones that didn't (ie: Softails) have counterbalancers to solve that issue. As of last year, the Sportsters received the same rubber mount treatment - but as a former '86 1100 Sportster owner I can say that vibration wasn't an issue anyways. At least not for me. And as the owner of an '04 Electra Glide Standard I can assure you that there is less vibration and more comfort with it than my three previous rides - a '99 Kawasaki Drifter 1500, '01 Triumph Tiger 955i and a '95 Triumph Thunderbird.

As for requiring lots of maintenance, I have almost 36,000km on mine with nothing other than the recommended service intervals every 8,000km and one change of tires at the 32,000km mark. IMO, someone is blowing smoke up your butt.

[allawybiker]

IMO, someone is blowing smoke up your butt.

Thanks for that. Somehow I knew the Harley guy would find a way to insult anyone questioning Harley's reliability. Anyway, thanks for the unbiased info.

So the answer to my question is that these people that I had talked to either owned older models, or were just making things up. Does anyone know if any specific Harley model/year is less reliable? Any model/year to avoid?

Telesque, you are correct. Gearing is the indicator of engine speed in relation to speed, but what would the max speed an engine is capable of mean? Also, could driving an engine capable of 90 max at 70-75 most of the time or for extended periods reduce the engine's life? Would I be pushing the engine to its limits? These are not Harley questions anymore, just mechanics...I am curious to know...

[mustangski]

I am somewhat of a new biker as this is only my second bike, I started this thread because I had some questions on an unfamiliar bike and I didn't want to damage it. I did not start it as a bash Harley or bash metric bikes thread. Why does it seem like everytime somebody mentions the word Harley it turns into a street brawl. I also am fairly new to this forum and have recieved alot of good advice from it. Now here is my two cents:

I DON'T CARE WHAT YOU RIDE AS LONG AS YOU ENJOY RIDING IT!!!!!!

[MASHBY]

I DON'T CARE WHAT YOU RIDE AS LONG AS YOU ENJOY RIDING IT!!!!!!

Great line mustangski.Thats why they are different makers and models of Motorbikes.Becuase not everyone wants the same.

I know its not a sportster but I rented an electra glide last summer it was great not very viby at all.But I do know they have recently put the engines on rubber mounts to help decrease the vibes a bit.And she could shift when she wanted to.

[Telesque]

IMO, someone is blowing smoke up your butt.

Thanks for that. Somehow I knew the Harley guy would find a way to insult anyone questioning Harley's reliability. Anyway, thanks for the unbiased info.

So the answer to my question is that these people that I had talked to either owned older models, or were just making things up. Does anyone know if any specific Harley model/year is less reliable? Any model/year to avoid?

Telesque, you are correct. Gearing is the indicator of engine speed in relation to speed, but what would the max speed an engine is capable of mean? Also, could driving an engine capable of 90 max at 70-75 most of the time or for extended periods reduce the engine's life? Would I be pushing the engine to its limits? These are not Harley questions anymore, just mechanics...I am curious to know...

The simplest way to answer that is basically that you're working with speed vs. acceleration.

You can tune an engine to have a high top speed, or you can tune an engine to pull a lot of weight. If you've ever played around with gear settings on a racing video game, this is a pretty good way to learn.

By reducing the amount of power an engine has to spend on a high gear (i.e. High speed) you increase the amount of power it has to accelerate. You also increase the amount of weight which the bike is able to move. It's sort of a balance in there, but that's the idea.

Now, in addition to this, larger engines produce more torque, but because of how engines work, generally have less horsepower (because of low RPM ranges). This makes them very useful for drag racing (accel.), but less useful for, say, Formula/Gran Prix racing (speed). That's both why heavy bikes, like cruisers, have larger engines, and also why cruisers aren't ashamed about weighing a lot more than sport bikes.

[Gummiente]

IMO, someone is blowing smoke up your butt.

Thanks for that. Somehow I knew the Harley guy would find a way to insult anyone questioning Harley's reliability. Anyway, thanks for the unbiased info.

Relax, it wasn't meant as an insult - it was my way of saying that the information you received from these Harley owners is suspect, in my opinion, especially if they own late model Harleys. If you don't think so, then please explain to me how to adjust valve clearance on a bike equipped with hydraulic lifters. Now try reading my post again without looking for insults this time - there aren't any there, intentionally or otherwise.

Having said all that, if you consider the opinions from someone who owns a Harley as being biased and insulting then who are you willing to accept them from?

[Digginit]

Harleys have push rods. Twin cams, but the cams are below the pistons. I believe the Japanese cruisers all have overhead cams. The push rods are heavy, and they slow the engine down basically--can't generate as many rpms. I ride a Harley. I'm not looking to go really fast. I disagree with the "needs a lot of maintenance" comments. Just folks looking to put down HD, IMHO. The twin cam set-up of the Harley makes 'em sound really nice driving down the road. Get a few of 'em together and it's really beautiful. I LIKE that sound. My bikes got some nice low end power, and cruises comfortably at 80 mph (which is faster than I feel a need to go usually). It suits my purposes, AND it's really sexy

There are other reasons that Harleys aren't so fast. This is just the one I chose to comment on today....

Peace~
linz

[iwannadie]

well at least someone got what i was asking and didnt assume i was all out harley bashing.

i just dont see how a big class motor like that is capped to such a slow speed, even if you dont plan on going 100mph but cruise 75-80(freeway speeds). why the need keep the engine on the edge of its peak ability? i cant see anyone wanting to run their bike at near redline for a full day riding. harleys are supposed to be for long freeway rides or back country. i know people with other cruises that can got alot faster and have better acceleration, im not going to compare a harley to a sports bike. harley obviously isnt sacrificing top end speed for acceleration. is it all about tourque? if needed could the harley pull a bus behind it(not literally). but is that a good way to relate where the power is being used. a tow truck has tons of power but not used for speed.

could it be that harely caps the speed just for the sake of doing it, some cars are like that.

i havent rode a harley before but when i hear people like Buzz who i take it to be an experienced rider/mechanic(well i assume, but he is canadian so....). i listen to what he says about issues on harleys or any other bike. ive known people with them and they all seem to back up these issues of maintence and vibration etc. of course i know some people that own a harley and arent even aware it needs oil because it goes to the dealer for service on a very strict schedule.

come on guys, the question and concern are valid. Not long ago, I was shopping for my first bike and did a lot of research via the Internet, talking to existing/prev. bikers, and going to show rooms. One thing that was consistent about the Harley is that they require a lot of maintenance and not very reliable; this is from 5 existing Harley owners. They listed several issues related to vibration, valve adjustments, etc... Two of them had a second bike (Japanese) and they said maintenance is very low or near nil. I don't claim to know much about Harley's let alone motorcycles in general, but when existing owners tell me that they like the image of owning one but not the amount of money/time they have to put into it, then I have to take their word for it...
Now, when I read iwannadie's reply I thought "ok so who care about 0-60 range?" but I do care where the engine is capped. If I compare two bikes that have the same engine size and close HP, I start wondering why one of them tops at 90mph while the other can do 120mph. I am not planning on getting to 100 or 120, but does it not mean that the engine would be revving higher on the Harley at the same speeds? I don't know the answer to the question, so can someone reply? And please, put your Harley hat aside as you read this, no one is putting Harley down just wondering if the comments we hear from Harley riders are correct! As a matter of fact, I started my search thinking I was going to purchase a Harley!

Piece

[Digginit]

Running at highway speeds, you're not running at your "peak ability" on a Harley. I can cruise very comfortably at a much faster speed than I cruise at all day long. That's not an issue. It won't cruise comfortably at 120 mph, but that's fine. That's understood. If those are concerns of yours, then it's probably not the bike you're looking for....

I don't think maintenance issues have been a real issues since AMF had HD. Most of my riding buddies ride Harleys, and have for years, and none of them has had "maintenance issues." My brother's riddent he same Harley for over 200,000 miles. Still runs great. I don't know ANYONE with a HD who has had all of these maintenance issues.... I really believe that it's just people who want to talk 'em down.

They still vibrate...it's the nature of a v twin to vibrate. They vibrate less than in years past though. I don't find it to be an issue. Nothing numbing about the vibration, except if you keep it running above 80/85 or so--if your feet are on the highway pegs, then the vibration's a little rough on the feet....

linz