89 Kaw won't shift into first cold

[honda750]

I have a 1989 Kawasaki 454 that refuses to shift into first when its cold or even after it has sat for anything over 5 minutes.
No matter what rpm i have it at it stalls out trying to start in first. While I'm riding I can shift fine, and it's only after it sits that I have ANY trouble.
When I let it the least bit it goes easily.
It's a belt driven 6-speed tranny.

http://www.bikebandit.com/partsbandit/o ... 289434.asp
http://www.bikez.com/bike/index.php?bike=12246


Any ideas could help...because I'm hoping to get it going today because I don't want to ride it because I fear I might be damaging something.

It was in an accident before I got it but there is no visual signs of anything.
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gremlin seeds

[roscowgo]

so it dies after sitting for a bit if you try to start it in gear. is your kickstand down?

if so will it start in second?

[honda750]

I guess I wasn't clear. I'm sorry. I'm sitting on the bike, the bike is running, and the bike is in 1st with the clutch engaged. When I try to start out and release the clutch, at any rpm when its cold or has sat for 5 minutes it dies.

It has the same exact symptoms trying to start out in second.

if the bike is rolling at all, it doesn't die and after that i can shift perfectly fine. This occurs even if the bike has been completely warmed up and just sitting running for anything over 5 minutes.


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Environmental Disorders Forum

[Sev]

How quickly are you letting out on the clutch? And at what RPM are you attempting to get going?

It sounds like a simple stall to me (at this point).

[honda750]

I've had this bike long enough to know the shift spots, so I'm not just stalling it out...and this just starting happening all of a sudden...
It's just as if I didn't have the RPM up high enough, but I've tried with every rpm imaginable...and it ONLY happens when its cold...shifts beautifully otherwise.
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Stewing Forum

[logitech104]

What does it feel like when it dies? Does it feel like it has no power, or does it inadvertently cut out??
Try putting it on full choke and then try to do the same.
My bike will do the same if I let it, in the morning and with no choke, but it is supposed to do that. It's just not warmed up, ya know?

[Shorts]

DHs Vulcan 400 is a bit moody in the cold and takes a little time to warmup before a ride.

Check that your idle speed is set right and your clutch lever is adjusted correctly.

[Wrider]

Alright, definitely no mechanic here, but sounds to me like tranny is freezing up when it hasn't been moved in some time... Could there be a gear in the tranny itself that is being deprived of oil while the bike is sitting still? Maybe some gunky buildup, especially considering it's an '89?
Wrider

[BuzZz]

Weak cylinder loading up? Questionable spark plug could cause the same thing. Then once you get it moving and under load, it clears out and fires normally?

The bike always rolls free and easy, hot or cold?

Just some thinks....

[safety-boy]

My 86 454 had no (working) kill switch at the kickstand, and the sensor was broken at the clutch handle, so the bike would start in any gear, kickstand up or down, clutch in or out... These I mention because it might be some weird electrical problem. As another side, my speedo went out, which kept the turn signal killer from working. Electrically, the 454 has a lot of moving parts.

Conjecture, below...

I am tempted to say the problem is the kickstand kill switch. The one on my bike was a ragged piece of cr@p. Could be that temp changes are flexing the thing enough to activate it? On the other hand, the bike knows when it is moving - notice your turn signals will stay on when you are at a light, then turn off after you move? There might be a failsafe in the same device that controls the turn signal that says, "don't kill the engine from the kick stand when the bike is moving." Thus you can shift to first while riding, but not at a stop.

Can't give you much help on how to diag this... Putting you kickstand down while rolling might prove kick stand is the culprit, but is not a good idea!

--Dave