Would you want to have UK-style licensing laws?

[jimyed]

No way, this is America, for god sakes, and I want my freedom. In fact, I do not like the fact that I have to get any sort of license what so ever. UK generally sucks in all things related to automotive laws, and they suck in this respect as well. I like people getting R1s as their first bike and killing them selves, then I can find cheep parts online for mine.

- Bogdan

Your attitude while typical of most North American's highlights the problem. We take things like riding as a right. In fact it should be regarded as a privledge. learning to actualy ride BEFORE geting an R1 wouldn't hurt any one and might just be a big help.
My 2 cents

jimyed, most North Americans do not share x0045's attitude.

+1 Not a common point of view, and lumping all of North America together is a little rash. Up here in Canada, from my experience, people don't think they are entitled to anything and everything they desire under the guise of 'freedom'.

I'm willing to change my view on that but I can tell you the here in Toronto almost everybody I talk to or see posts from on the local GTA forum sure seem like they think riding is a right not a privilege. I hope I’m wrong but…

[Kibagari]

Even lumping all AMERICANS together is a load of bull. It varies from state to state and from neighborhood to neighborhood. Just because you see a bunch of Americans doing something, does not necessarily mean that all of us do.

This goes double so for North America, which includes MORE than one country (Unless you're forgetting that Nova Scotia, Canada, and Mexico exist).

So before you go lumping all Americans into one big pot as speed-addicted morons, look at the demographics.


Same goes for the UK, you can't make a valid assumption based on the UK as a whole. You have to take it apart piece by piece and examine it all.

[NorthernPete]

Even lumping all AMERICANS together is a load of bull. It varies from state to state and from neighborhood to neighborhood. Just because you see a bunch of Americans doing something, does not necessarily mean that all of us do.

This goes double so for North America, which includes MORE than one country (Unless you're forgetting that Nova Scotia, Canada, and Mexico exist).

So before you go lumping all Americans into one big pot as speed-addicted morons, look at the demographics.


Same goes for the UK, you can't make a valid assumption based on the UK as a whole. You have to take it apart piece by piece and examine it all.

heh heh heh...... thats a good un.

[x0054]

I second the natural selection statement. I am against the helmet laws, against the CC restrictions, speed limiters, and anything else that requires people to be safer. If you are not wearing a helmet you are stupid, and deserve to select your self right out. Same is true about an idiot on an R1, though one could make an argument that R1 will cause damage to others too, but that's a chance I am willing to take, and chances are, it want kill any one other then the rider.

I think it's only the need to feel superior that forces people to control actions of others when those others will never effect your own well being, even if they really "fudge" up. It's the "we know best" attitude which I dislike about US, even though we really do, and I can not stand the political systems of EU just because of this issue. Let people kill them selves, it's good for society for people to die. Look at the helmet laws. Since they repealed the laws in several states the death rate for bikers went up, but the coma rates went down! Is it better to be in a coma or dead, ask your self.

Same is true about the people who start on R1, yes, you should tell them not to do it, you should explain why, you should try to persuade. But you should never, ever, limit the choices. People do stupid things every day and we as a society have tried to limit the ability of people to make stupid choices and the consequences of such choices through means like tort system and congressionally imposed mandates. This is a BAD idea, stupid people live, reproduce, and create more stupid people. See Idiocracy (movie). Let them die in peace, for god sakes, let them die!

I would love for some one to explain to me why I should ever care if some idiot kills them self on a bike, again, more junk yard parts for me. What's wrong with that? This will probably get a lot of flame, but remember, I am not advocating not informing people about the dangers of bikes, I am advocating for informed freedom.

- Bogdan

[blues2cruise]

No way, this is America, for god sakes, and I want my freedom. In fact, I do not like the fact that I have to get any sort of license what so ever. UK generally sucks in all things related to automotive laws, and they suck in this respect as well. I like people getting R1s as their first bike and killing them selves, then I can find cheep parts online for mine.

- Bogdan

As long as there are people like you who act like schmucks there will always be a need for some sort of legislation for licensing., etc.
Freedom doesn't mean you get to do whatever you dammn well please.
Your attitude regarding the availability of cheap parts is quite disturbing.

[blues2cruise]

I think a graduated form of licensing and a certain amount of limitations on what bike you can get for a first bike are a good idea.

I also think that riding lessons should be mandatory.

[x0054]

Your attitude regarding the availability of cheap parts is quite disturbing.

And I think that women should not drive because they suck at it, and that Nineteenth Amendment was a mistake all together. But all the same, look at that, they can. You know why, freedom, yes, it comes at a cost.

I understand the issue with people crashing and killing someone else. But look at it this way. Someone who is stupid enough to kill them selves on an R1 will simply do it in a camaro if the bike option is not available. And do 10x the damage. I say let them kill them selves at the cheapest possible price to our society.

As far as the availability of cheep parts because people are killing them selves, I am indeed being facetious. But you got to admit, it sad when a good rider slips an hurts them selves, but I can not care less when some idiot buys a bike too big for them and finds the first pole.

I am a lawyer by trade, guess giving my kind a bad name yet again, but I heard a story from a colleague that is pertinent. There was a guy in central Wisconsin who used to ride bikes 20 something years ago. So in 2006 he picks up a ZX1400 and takes it for a ride, after a 20 year brake. And, as you may guess, he finds the first pole on the road with none for miles, and promptly crashes into it while going somewhere in the neighborhood of 150MPH. He side swipes the pole and rips off his lag and arm, clean rip. But survives. Now, do you feel bad for this guy, do you? I sure don't. The guy is an idiot, and should not have ridden, and yet he would be perfectly legal to ride in UK, in US, and any wear else.

Cool part of that story, the guy ended up suing Kawasaki because he claimed the triple clamps bolts were loose and that's why he crashed. Well, my buddy hired a firm to recreate the crash. I actually saw the video where they loosened all the bolts, installed stoppers so the trees would not slip down. The front end was completely loose. And this test driver guy takes it to 120MPH, picks the front end up and slams it into the ground. Lends the wheel sideways on purpose and nothing happens, the bike tank slaps and then stabilizes it's self in a 10th of a second. To see it was pretty awesome. The bike owner lost the suit.

The point is, when you make tough laws, you make it hard for reasonable people like you and me, well at least you, to comply with them. While the idiot contingent in our society will still find a way to bypass the law and hurt them selves and others. More education is better then more legislation.

- Bogdan

[dean owens]

boortz? is that you?

[shane-o]

No way, this is America, for god sakes, and I want my freedom. In fact, I do not like the fact that I have to get any sort of license what so ever. UK generally sucks in all things related to automotive laws, and they suck in this respect as well. I like people getting R1s as their first bike and killing them selves, then I can find cheep parts online for mine.

- Bogdan

cough unwitty cough cough

[shane-o]

Most states in Australia use a power/weight restriction for learners.

ie.

you can ride a ducati monster 620 learner legal

you can NOT ride a aprillia 250 rs



you can ride a SV650s learner legal

you can NOT ride a honda NSR 150



I think its a pretty fair system, starting from scratch you can have a full unrestricted bike license in about 15 months so long as you alreay hold a valid drivers license, if you dont have a car license then add an extra year to restrictions.