Am I "The Enemy" now?

[TechTMW]

Today I was in an Accident in my car - a scooter ran into me...

T-intersection, one stop sign, I had the stop - stopped, looked both ways and pulled out, turning left. heard beeping, and this guy and his wife on a 150 honda scooter come flying at me from the left.. Stopped ... But he couldn't compensate - he tried, but just couldn't swerve enough. his scoot touched my front bumper and he landed square on my hood. His wife flipped over him and landed on her back in the street.

Results - Both were dressed for the beach, but surprisingly little road rash. My car broke their fall. They both had helmets on at least. The Wife had to go to the hospital, nothing serious, I think she just had the wind knocked out of her. If you've ever been in a traffic accident in Italy, it's really an amazing thing - in this no-residential area, a crowd of about 100 people gathered in the span of about 30 seconds. People screaming and yelling - the husband's screaming at me calling me lots of bad words. ... Well. It's tough when you aren't completely proficient in a language, especially when the cops and ambulance come.

He was driving without insurance, and the police fined him. That calmed him down alot. Although it will probably turn out that I take full responsibility for the accident - In Italy, if you have the stop sign, you're almost immediately guilty. It's a poor intersection - lots of overgrowth blocking the street, but still I feel terrible. I really work hard at keeping an eye out for bikers when I'm in the car, so this really hit me hard. Thank goodness I have full coverage insurance too - and thank goodness no one was seriously injured. The scooter ripped out part of my plastic bumper (It was my wife's car, new beetle) Whatever caught on it just peeled the plastic back like nothing, The front fog lights are gone and there's a huge dent in the hood from where the guy landed.

My Italian friends say that he'll probably try to sue me, being as I'm an American and probably have cash to give away. I'll fight it of course, if he decides to do that, after all, he was speeding (about 45 in a 25) and was without insurance. But still I really feel pretty bad about the whole thing.

[Sev]

I know it's a tough thing to go through, but if things went down the way you say they did then it wasn't really your fault. You did a full stop, looked both directions, saw the all clear and proceded. Is there anywhere he could have popped out of? Or anything like that. If he was speeding then you might even be able to turn around and counter sue him or something. I'm not exactly sure on Italian law.

[ZooTech]

My Italian friends say that he'll probably try to sue me, being as I'm an American and probably have cash to give away. I'll fight it of course, if he decides to do that, after all, he was speeding (about 45 in a 25) and was without insurance. But still I really feel pretty bad about the whole thing.

You did everything you could, Tech. When you stopped at the T-intersection you checked both ways and made concessions for traffic going 25mph. By going 45mph, the other guy rendered your precaution null and void. It is reasonable and lawful to expect appoaching traffic to be doing the speed limit. Therefore you are not at fault.

The fact that you feel bad about it doesn't mean you're guilty, it means you are a decent human being with compassion for your fellow man. My hat's off to you, my friend, and thank the good Lord nobody was badly hurt or killed.

[Sev]

Agreed, I'd be more worried if you felt good about it.

[old-n-slow]

Good luck if he sues. YOU say he was speeding and I'm sure he was but how do you prove it? The fact that he was uninsured has nothing to do with your liability in this instance. The fact that you have plenty of insurance might turn out to be a good thing. You may have your work cut out for you. keep the Fingers crossed............

[Randy]

Well, I was a Military Policeman in Vicenza Italy. While I saw my fair share of accidents that were the fault of the locals, I also saw most of those locals sue the unfortunate American. Most of the time the police statements were used and for the most part dictated who won and who lost. If the police report said you were at fault, get ready to leave the country or open your pocketbook.

I am no legal expert, but I can say what I saw. Amercians very often took it in the O-Ring. Bear in mind though, that I was in Italy in the early 90's, so it might be different.

For my part, I say you aren't the enemy. Now do that in America and I may have something different to say.

Some of those Cagiva scooters were pretty cool though.

[iwannadie]

if the police report says its your fault then your screwed. if the police report doesnt point any blame its your advantage. he had a ticket issued you had no thing. id fight it, dont give any money out to them. doubtfull they have cash to get a decent lawyer on their side to make a case. be cheaper to fight it and drag it out as long as you can till they go broke paying lawyers.

[mattf]

You did everything you could, Tech. When you stopped at the T-intersection you checked both ways and made concessions for traffic going 25mph. By going 45mph, the other guy rendered your precaution null and void. It is reasonable and lawful to expect appoaching traffic to be doing the speed limit. Therefore you are not at fault.

if things went down the way you say they did then it wasn't really your fault.

Not true on both accounts, at least in america. Even if the other car is drunk driving and speeding without a liscense, you are still at fault because you had the stop sign and they had right of way. Sure, speed is a contributing factor, but, again in America, you would be found guilty of "failure to yield to right of way". Been there, done that, and the opposing car was speeding about the same amount.

These guys are doing you a disservice telling you you're not at fault. And there's no way to know how fast he was going, really. We can guess, but you didn't see him until he was already on the brakes and horn, and decelerating rapidly. No telling how fast he was going.

[iwannadie]

You did everything you could, Tech. When you stopped at the T-intersection you checked both ways and made concessions for traffic going 25mph. By going 45mph, the other guy rendered your precaution null and void. It is reasonable and lawful to expect appoaching traffic to be doing the speed limit. Therefore you are not at fault.

if things went down the way you say they did then it wasn't really your fault.

Not true on both accounts, at least in america. Even if the other car is drunk driving and speeding without a liscense, you are still at fault because you had the stop sign and they had right of way. Sure, speed is a contributing factor, but, again in America, you would be found guilty of "failure to yield to right of way". Been there, done that, and the opposing car was speeding about the same amount.

These guys are doing you a disservice telling you you're not at fault. And there's no way to know how fast he was going, really. We can guess, but you didn't see him until he was already on the brakes and horn, and decelerating rapidly. No telling how fast he was going.

you can only yield the right of way so much. he did stop at the stop sign looked and saw noone and proceeded through the intersection. if a car is speeding around a blind turn the car going through a stop sign is not at fault. what is he supposed to do sit at the stop sign forever because there is infact a chance a car can come around at 200mph and nail him before he can do anything about it.

you come to a stop sign, fully stop and check proceeding through the intersection with caution. thats all he can do and its not his fault. the scooter may have been hidden in shadows due to no day time headlight or reflectors. speeding causing it to come across the intersection unsafely. any number of things can take away resposibility in this situation.

no judge jury would find him soley at fault in that situation. thats when they start to look at past driving records and more details about the situation. the guy on the moped has no insurance, likely to have past violations which is a pattern of wreckless driving, if the guy that hit him has a clean record it shows hes the more sensable driver, likely to mean he was in the right in that particular situation.

the best case is to get a lawyer no question if the moped pursues you. dont responed in any way without a lawyer.

[Mintbread]

Would you have proceeded through the stop sign if you were on a bike, with the possibility of a car wiping you out as he came around the corner?