Help me win a helmet debate!

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DJGroove · #1 Unread post by **DJGroove** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:08 am

Ok, I have a co-worker that truly believes that a helmet is useless to prevent death in a motorcycle accident. Help me win this argument!

Her argument is that most motorcycle deaths are caused by thoracic impact and not head injury so wearing a helmet to prevent death is useless. She does grant that they will protect against road rash, but will not accept that they will prevent brain damage or other head trauma. Of course, she has "data" to back this up, but I have not seen it yet.

I told her about the shock absorbing qualities of a good full-face helmet, but she doesn't believe that small amount of protection will prevent brain damage or internal injury.

She does not ride anymore and, ironically, always wore a full-face helmet when she did. So, can ya help me out?

Thanks!

CNF2002 · #2 Unread post by **CNF2002** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:40 am

I saw a girl go down in my MSF course @ 20MPH...she was fine except her body and head hit the ground...a little scrape on the elbow but the knock was hard enough to unclip the visor from her helmet. No doubt she would have had a good concussion without her helmet.

If she doesn't think the helmet prevents head trauma offer up a test. Whack her in the head with and without wearing a helmet and see what happens.

Wizzard · #3 Unread post by **Wizzard** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:36 pm

No body ever likes my opinion on this excepting maybe Zoo because I happen to agree with the lady in question and not you . Sorry bout that .
Regards , Wizzard

ZooTech · #4 Unread post by **ZooTech** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 12:47 pm

CNF2002 wrote:I saw a girl go down in my MSF course @ 20MPH...she was fine except her body and head hit the ground...a little scrape on the elbow but the knock was hard enough to unclip the visor from her helmet. No doubt she would have had a good concussion without her helmet.

When's the last time you fell four feet and slammed your head into the ground? Now add the weight of a helmet to the equation. That'll drag your head to the pavement every time. If all she had was a little scrape otherwise then I imagine the helmet was the cause of the head impact, so all it did was protect her from an incident it actually caused.

Mintbread · #5 Unread post by **Mintbread** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:00 pm

Based on what? Way to just make something up to support your argument.

I had an accident where I hit a car at about 45mph, flew at least 30 feet and landed in a gutter on the other side of the intersection. My helmet was completely unscathed.

In an impact without a helmet the head gets thrown around. The muscles in your neck are not capable of stopping that sort of momentum. Ever seen a crash test dummy in a car accident? It is a no contest.

To fall backwards from an upright position and land on a hard surface and hitting your head is enough to cause massive head injuries, even death.

ZooTech · #6 Unread post by **ZooTech** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:06 pm

Mintbread wrote:Based on what? Way to just make something up to support your argument.

CNF2002 wrote:the knock was hard enough to unclip the visor from her helmet. No doubt she would have had a good concussion without her helmet.

Yeah...gee...you're right...and his argument was so rock solid...

Mintbread · #7 Unread post by **Mintbread** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:13 pm

I was talking to you.

so all it did was protect her from an incident it actually caused.

Based on what? Way to just make something up to support your argument.

ZooTech · #8 Unread post by **ZooTech** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:29 pm

Mintbread wrote:I was talking to you.

I know. You publically challenge my argument while ignoring another with the same level of "proof". That's inconsistent. He assumes that without the helmet she would have suffered a concussion, and I submit that her head would never have touched the road had it not been for the helmet. Why ask me to "support my argument" when no support was offered up for the opposing view? If you want proof or, at least, personal observation, I can attest that after dozens of ATV wrecks over a span of roughly ten years, the times when I was wearing a helmet I always hit my head on the ground. But the times I went sans helmet I never so much as got my head dirty. So, how can you argue that the helmet saved me from head injuries all those times when it appears that the helmet itself caused the contact with the ground? You're drawing conclusions based on helmet damage without considering the added weight of the helmet itself and how it drastically changes the physics of a crash.

Wizzard · #9 Unread post by **Wizzard** » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:38 pm

Deja Vu !

Mintbread · Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:40 pm

I take it you have never seen the crash test dummies I mentioned earlier. If you think you are able to control your head during a major impact then I believe you are kidding yourself.

I have had several accidents on my road bike and was wearing a helmet during all of them. On two occasions my helmet did not touch the ground and in the other two my helmet pounded in so heavily that I am sure I would be dead without it.
I agree that in certain instances you are capable of keeping your head off the ground (even with a helmet on) but when faced with a fast, hard impact, you are merely along for the ride. Momentum rules.