There may be hope for us yet...

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#21 Unread post by **cb360** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 4:40 am

ZooTech wrote:Speak for yourself.

I was.

Now somebody tell me the one about how pomeranians and great Danes evolved from the same two dogs that were on the ark. I need a good laugh today.

Loonette · #22 Unread post by **Loonette** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 7:10 am

I believe that God (or whatever you want to call it) created the Universe as an evolving place with evolving creatures for our evolving minds to contemplate. And frankly, I don't believe that we are ever supposed to really figure this all out with any definitive answer - after, what would the point of existence as humans be if we had nothing left to figure out? Hey, maybe we're all living in the Matrix!!

And before anyone jumps all over my brief, simplistic, "crackpot" theory, please note that I used the word "believe". That's all it is.

Cheers,
Loonette

CNF2002 · #23 Unread post by **CNF2002** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 7:20 am

And before anyone jumps all over my brief, simplistic, "crackpot" theory, please note that I used the word "believe". That's all it is.

Well I agree with you there. I mean an omnipotent being would have the foresight to create a universe that is self-maintaining...otherwise he'd be so busy changing species to adapt to environmental changes, the guy would never get a break! He rested on the 7th day, everyone needs a break!

#24 Unread post by **cb360** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:10 am

"If so, now would be a great time for the evolutionists to actually prove something."

The 'proof' is in every major library at every accredited university in the world - well, maybe not at Liberty University. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Evolution 'proof' is well established by legions of people way smarter than any of us. Where's the 'proof' for the claims of the bible? I mean testable and reproduceable experiments. Faith is the absence of proof.

I posted the link simply because it was heartening to me to see that there are many thousands of educated religious persons who don't eschew the teachings of science and see no problems studying biology and then praying to their god after class. It reminded me of my college biology teacher. He announced on the first day of class that he believed in god, was a born-again christian and even served as a deacon at the local baptist church. He then explained that he would not discuss the creation story or the bible in his class and encouraged those interested to take a theology or religion class in another building where he assured those interested that they would not infringe on their time by discussing biology. He went on to explain that he had no problem reconciling his heart... "god created the evolutionary process, this does not trouble me, now let's turn to chapter one."

#25 Unread post by **Sev** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:39 am

This about thumbs up my thoughts on the subject:

CNF2002 · #26 Unread post by **CNF2002** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:07 am

That comic makes no sense.

#27 Unread post by **Sev** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:19 am

See... it's funny because that's one of the arguments that is used as proof that God exists I see a lot. That there has to be an intellegent designer behind the creation of life on Earth. Now Bob the Angry Flower had a group of scientists make up a living cell out of non-organic material then went back in time 40 million years and released it. Thus starting life on Earth. Meaning he must be God...

TechTMW · #28 Unread post by **TechTMW** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 9:51 am

cb360 wrote: The 'proof' is in every major library at every accredited university in the world - well, maybe not at Liberty University.

So please, go get this proof and post it.

Evolution 'proof' is well established by legions of people way smarter than any of us. Where's the 'proof' for the claims of the bible? I mean testable and reproduceable experiments. Faith is the absence of proof.

The claims of the bible are not the main point. There are alternative theories of life that are rejected out of hand because they are not "evolutionary" in nature. Some of these theories claim that the earth is younger than evolutionary scientists believe.

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Here you go - Common and everyday proof that evolution is a flawed theory. Open your eyes to the alternatives of a flawed theory. You don't even have to be a Christian to see the proof all around you.

Languages are Devolving - Evolutionists claim language evolved - therefore the earliest languages should be the least complex. Not true. The most early languages are more complex than modern ones.

Fully Developed Organs - If a leg evolves into a wing, wouldn't it be a hell of a bad leg for millions of years? Wouldn't this wipe out a species?

New Species - Species are only observed going out of existence. New Species have never been observed coming into existance.

Multi-celled life - There are Single-celled forms of life, and there are forms of life with 6 or more cells. But none that consist of 2-5 cells. Furthermore, those forms of life with 6-20 cells are classified as parasites (They need complex animal hosts to survive - breathe and digest for them.) If macroevolution occurs, why are there no 2-20 celled organisms that can survive on their own. (Transitional forms of life)

Fossil Gaps - no explanation necessary

Old Human Remains - Ask an evolutionist to explain the Calveras Skull, the Castenedolo Skeletons, or the Recks skeleton. All are human remains extracted from undisturbed rocks which well predate the beginning of man's supposed evolution. How is this possible?

Human Garbage - Man-made objects (Gold chains, pots, spears, etc) have been found encased in coal. Coal formed hundreds of millions of years before the existance of man - according to evolutionists, of course.

Oxygen-Rich Atmosphere - Amino Acids are a necessary component of the evolution of life. Oxygen destroys amino acids. Amino acids can only link up to form Protiens in an environment without oxygen. But without oxygen, there would be no ozone layer, and the Ultraviolet rays of the sun would have burned away life long before it started. Therefore, Oxygen and Amino Acids must have come into existance simultaneously. (they were created)

DNA Production - DNA cannot function without at least 75 different protiens. But protiens are only produced by DNA. As they are co-dependant, the whole process must have come into being at the same time.

The Earth's Temperature - Is consistant with a young-earth theory. If the planet was molten (per the evolution theory) billions of years ago, it would have cooled off alot more than it has.

The other planets too - Jupiter, Saturn, and Neptune all give off more than twice the heat energy that they get from the sun. Science cannot explain why this is, as it is proven to NOT be nuclear decay, gravitational contraction, or phase changes in the planets. They are simply young and have not cooled off.

The Sun is Shrinking Since 1836, astronomers have made direct measurements of the sun which prove that is is shrinking at a rate of about Five feet per hour. Indirect observations of the sun show that this has been consistant for 400 years. At that rate, the Sun would have been too big and hot to support life as late as several million years ago - when evolutions say that life on earth was pretty much the same as it is now.

SEX! - Probably the most important EVERY-DAY fact of life that disproves Evolution.
- Males and Females must have come into existance at the exact same time, with completely formed and functional reproductive organs and they must have evolved at the same location.
- Physical, Emotional and Chemical Compatibility between the sexes
- The Reproductive systems must be compatible
- The Fertilized egg must have developed without any problem
- The offspring of that one first fertilized egg must have survived and mated with another ... fully formed and compatible creature.
- This string of events had to have happened "Accidentally" for millions of species
- Or, they were created.
P.S. - Evolution supports Asexual reproduction - One organism splits into two organisms. Evolution cannot support complex sexual diversity.

#29 Unread post by **cb360** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:33 am

TechBMW - there's nothing there worth responding to on a scientific level. You know a lot about motorcycles but it looks like you get your science from really bad anti-evolution websites. I really don't want the same old evolution dogfight between demagogues - it's no fun and no one learns anything and it gets personal and everyone gets mad and that's no fun. I merely thought it was cool that there are thousands of christians - not just christians, but clergy who lead entire congregations in spiritual matters - who see no need to rewrite all the science books in order to reconcile them with the bible. And I think that's cool so I posted a link to it. I'm not a christian so I could give a rat's "O Ring" about the bible most of the time. It's mind-numbingly boring - a trait it shares with most religious texts, many older than the bible. Most of us know nothing of the other texts and chose the bible to follow merely because we were born among its adherents. A geographic lottery if you will. If you were born in Afghanistan you'd have a koran in your back pocket. And the level of hypocrisy displayed by those who attack evolution is staggering. Why is everyone so up in arms about that single subject? The world would be a truly better place if we paid a tenth as much attention to the beatitudes or the sermon on the mount as we did to the freaking evolution controversy from genesis of all places. But the actual teachings of christ get precious little play - we'd all rather fight about something than suffer or forgive or be generous.

CNF2002 · #30 Unread post by **CNF2002** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:45 am

If a leg evolves into a wing, wouldn't it be a hell of a bad leg for millions of years? Wouldn't this wipe out a species?

Tell that to penguins but...wings evolved out of ARMS not LEGS.

Evolutionists claim language evolved - therefore the early languages should be the least complex. Not true. The most earliest languages are more complex than modern ones.

Since when does evolution mean things have to go from primitive to more complex? Evolution is the adaptation of a thing to an environment, be it cultural (like language) or biological (like wings out of LEGS apparently).

Species are only observed going out of existence. New Species have never been observed coming into existance.

New species are discovered every day...good grief species divergence occurs over millions of years...you dont have one species one generation and a different one the next, species close in generations can mate...stop reading creationist literature on evolution and pick up a real science book and you might learn something.

There are Single-celled forms of life, and there are forms of life with 6 or more cells. But none that consist of 2-5 cells. Furthermore, those forms of life with 6-20 cells are classified as parasites (They need complex animal hosts to survive - breathe and digest for them.) If macroevolution occurs, why are there no 2-20 celled organisms that can survive on their own. (Transitional forms of life)

I have no idea what this is supposed to prove, if anything.

Ask an evolutionist to explain the Calveras Skull, the Castenedolo Skeletons, or the Recks skeleton. All are human remains extracted from undisturbed rocks which well predate the beginning of man's supposed evolution. How is this possible?

Never even heard of it...but then I'm not a scientist...this is probably just based on false information anyway.

Man-made objects (Gold chains, pots, spears, etc) have been found encased in coal. Coal formed hundreds of millions of years before the existance of man - according to evolutionists, of course.

LOL where are you getting this stuff from?

I dont have time to bother replying to every ridiculous thing because you won't care what I say anyway, but I'll end with this smacker.

Males and Females must have come into existance at the exact same time, with completely formed and functional reproductive organs and they must have evolved at the same location. Posted: Wed Jan 25, - Physical, Emotional and Chemical Compatibility between the species
- The Reproductive systems must be compatible
- The Fertilized egg must have developed without any problem
- The offspring of that one first fertilized egg must have survived and mated with another ... fully formed and compatible creature.
- This string of events had to have happened "Accidentally" for millions of species
- Or, they were created.

You know nothing about evolution. In any case, don't worry about it...believe what you want and let the rest of the world benefit from science. Just keep it out of schools where real education belongs.