Total Motorcycle Community Forums

TorontoBoy wrote:Reduce your risk with the following (From "Proficient Motorcycling", David Hough):
-wear a helmet
-don't drink and ride: If you drink at night, don't ride in the morning. Avoid times and locations where drunk drivers frequent
-don't ride at night
Also:
-don't speed
-ride like you're invisible

Ya'know, the "Don't ride at night" thing is kind of hard to plan around. Do you mean after dark? Or some particular time of night? Avoidance is no way to gain confidence.

Avoiding the stuff that "could" be dangerous seems kind of pointless. There are drunk drivers out at 2 in the afternoon. I'd have to say that they're probably MORE dangerous than the 'after closing time' drunks because no one expects them to be out there, so we're not prepared.

My typical commute is at 3am. About 35 miles each way. What would you suggest?

The key is to heighten your awareness of other drivers after dark. Both your and their visibility is reduced. Pay attention to those little clues that indicate potential impaired driving and if you spot any, get the heck outta range!

If you've NEVER ridden in rain, because you took the car (or didn't ride) every time rain was forecast. What happens if you misjudge and end up needing to ride in rain to get home? Do you freak out? What would be the best way to prepare yourself for the eventuality of riding in the rain? How about taking a chance, with a planned rain outing, to find out how different it really is, so you aren't forced into freak out mode by the unexpected.

P

Lion_Lady wrote: Ya'know, the "Don't ride at night" thing is kind of hard to plan around. Do you mean after dark? Or some particular time of night? Avoidance is no way to gain confidence.

Avoiding the stuff that "could" be dangerous seems kind of pointless. There are drunk drivers out at 2 in the afternoon. I'd have to say that they're probably MORE dangerous than the 'after closing time' drunks because no one expects them to be out there, so we're not prepared.

...

If you've NEVER ridden in rain, because you took the car (or didn't ride) every time rain was forecast. What happens if you misjudge and end up needing to ride in rain to get home? Do you freak out? What would be the best way to prepare yourself for the eventuality of riding in the rain? How about taking a chance, with a planned rain outing, to find out how different it really is, so you aren't forced into freak out mode by the unexpected.

P

I remember the first time I drove a truck (not 4x4 BTW) in the snow. Yeah, it was pretty scary, but I know I couldn't get out of it, so I just pushed through it. Come to find out it really isn't that bad as long as you stay calm, be alert, and don't punch the gas like an idiot. Granted, a bike is different than a truck, but still, freaking out b/c of a situation isn't going to help any. Might as well face the challenge and move through it.

I don't recall anyone complaining to me about that incident. I even wrecked my truck once at 3 am because I fell asleep at the wheel. I was okay, and the truck really wasn't hurt that bad, no one said anything. But all the sudden, just MENTIONING that I want a bike, the whole family goes NUTS. Doesn't make sense to me.

I had never heard the "don't ride at night" warning before. Maybe it's just me, but I think bikes are much more visible at night than they are in the daytime (assuming they have their lights one ).

Left Turn Larry sitting in an intersection is going to see that single headlight coming and wonder if it's a cage with a light out.

Edit : I was thinking mostly about city driving above. Nighttime is definitely more dangerous on the open road. Animals and obstacles can appear out of nowhere.

I certainly agree with flynrider about the night time issue. Bike lights are much more visible after dark, and more cagers tend to hear a bike approaching from either direction due to less overall traffic noise. After thousands of miles of driving and riding experience, I have witnessed far less of any potential accidents waiting to happen once the sun sets primarily because fewer people are in a crazed hurry to reach their destination and are far less distracted over their drive time. Whereas riding during the day, you obviously benefit greater visibility, but you must continuously stay on guard because there are far more cagers cutting off other cagers, pulling out in front of each other, changing lanes while a vehicle is directly in their blind spot, or simply driving aggressive or pissed off at well above the speed limit.

But I wouldn't suggest riding through rural areas at night unless you have to. There are too many animals to watch out for riding country after dark, just as there are plenty of animals behind the wheel throughout an urban jungle. At least when you cruise the city, enough light is provided.

I like riding at night, in fact last night, after finishing my wind screen 12:30AM, I had to take it for a ride - and not only for a ride, but out to the Parkway - down a few miles and back up again.

No point in testing it on the local roads where I have little problems.

Anyway, I feel less endangered at night - because there are far fewer cars on the road.

But last night (and I knew this was a mistake) it seemed that the few idiots that were driving needed to tailgate me.

Statistically, though, it says something else...

For one thing, there are a lot fewer motorcyclists on the road at night, but more accidents (60%) happen at night.

So, without question it is more dangerous to ride at night (in general) but specific riders may be safer with experience.

My experience has been (1) close call during the day and (0) close calls at night. The close call during the day was yesterday. Stopped at a light after a slight hill over the Parkway. Two idiots must have been racing - one zipped through the light to my right. So, I'm blaring on my horn (which I'm sure I'm the only one can hear) and a second idiot comes up - actually sees the red light and stops -sharing the lane with me - the front of his car even with my front tire.

I was very glad I had picked the lane position that I had.

So, my wife and I checked it out by car - and drove up to that light - and vehicles might be hidden stopped at the light, but the light is visible and clearly red - from a long ways away before the intersection. Idiots.

Anyway.

Of course, on my ride there was a multi-car (at least three) accident off to the side of the Parkway - blocking the two rightmost lanes. With such low volume of traffic I can only think there was a drunk drive. The two of the cars were facing the wrong direction and there like 4 police cars + other emergency vehicles.

I did discover Hough's book about over driving your headlights last night on the local roads. Most roads are well lit but where I got off on the Parkway was a darker more suburban area than where I live.

Oh and of course, it is harder to see road defects and hazards at night.

After 3AM, the number of accidents/fatalities decline significantly.

RhadamYgg

My dad tried to tell me a motorcycle was too dangerous even though he had one when he was younger. Boy did he ever do some dumb stuff on his bike. I'm not saying I'm Mr. Safety or anything, but I'd never try to ride on a pipe over a ditch. In any case, I ignored him and that worked out pretty well. He seems to be coming around though and he even bought me a motorcycle stand without asking if I wanted one.

Lion_Lady wrote:Ya'know, the "Don't ride at night" thing is kind of hard to plan around. Do you mean after dark? Or some particular time of night? Avoidance is no way to gain confidence.

Avoiding the stuff that "could" be dangerous seems kind of pointless. There are drunk drivers out at 2 in the afternoon. I'd have to say that they're probably MORE dangerous than the 'after closing time' drunks because no one expects them to be out there, so we're not prepared.

If we wanted to eliminate risk we wouldn't be riding. Risk management is a sliding scale of increased risk for increased benefit. When riding at night your eyes simply can't see as well as in the day, and therefore you cannot perceive road and vehicular dangers as quickly or as well. Ditto for other drivers. Therefore you are more at risk riding after dark than riding during the day. Critters also come out at night to play on the road, something they don't normally do during the day.

I'm not saying never ride at night, but to say if you ride at night you are increasing your risk. If you must ride at night then ride. Once a newby gets some miles under their belt I do recommend riding at night, and in the rain, but not both at the same time. Increase your risk gradually as you increase your experience level. Riding at night has a certain "cool" factor, visually, psychologically and thermally.

As for the drunk drivers out there, that's tougher. If you know of a section of road that has a bunch of bars, don't ride down that road near or after closing time if an alternate route is available. You can meet a drunk driver any time you're out there, but do all you can to avoid them. The likelihood of meeting a drunk driver is higher at night than during the early morning/day, though drivers with a hangover can still test positive for DUI.

I believe David Hough covered both points in his Proficient Motorcycling book. We all ride and we all take risks, that's a given. The whole point of this thread from the OP is "overcoming fear of bike". Following some simple rules when starting to ride will reduce your risk and therefore should reduce your fears of riding.

Okay, TorontoBoy. You said, "Don't ride at night."

See?

TorontoBoy wrote: Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 7:38 am

Reduce your risk with the following (From "Proficient Motorcycling", David Hough):
-wear a helmet
-don't drink and ride: If you drink at night, don't ride in the morning. Avoid times and locations where drunk drivers frequent
-don't ride at night

Also:
-don't speed
-ride like you're invisible

Seems like a blanket statment to me. Its smarter to make a list of things to DO, its shorter than a list of things to AVOID.

Do:
Get training.
Wear full gear EVERY RIDE.
Ride like you're invisible.
Do be extra aware in reduced visiblity (nighttime, lowlight or fog/rain).
Expect drivers to do stupid stuff.
Ride within limits (speed, road conditions, visibility...)

Call me old fashioned, but have you considered telling them to f*ck off and quit treating you like a little kid? Risks are there, and no matter how careful you are, something terrible can happen to you on a motorcycle. Something terrible can also happen to your kids on a swingset, no matter how careful they are ... or to anyone when swimming ... or when eating ... life is short and fraught with risks and uncertainties. Pity the people whose apparent goal is to make it to their deathbed and say, "Whew! Made it safely!"


Frank

LionLady - "ambulance" is spelled wrong in your signature.

TheRaceMaster