America....it takes united work to keep it, Great!

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ejshotgun · #1 Unread post by **ejshotgun** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 3:27 am

I for one am proud to be an American. As I'm sure the majority of the American contributors to this forum are.
But the government is made of quite a diversity of human beings. So being human means we make mistakes. Now I'm in no position to say "so-in-so" is totally responsible for seemingly bad choices. Especially when the only knowledge of the subject is through the media (I'm not even going to start that one).
I'm not happy with some of the decisions that our government has made in the past 4 years or so but since this is a democracy we have the choice to vote on the local level, all the way through the national level, to see that our issues are dealt with (not to mention the freedom to gripe about it).
I wonder if the people who gripe so loudly in an un-seen forum gripe so loudly in a public venue.
And for my self I'll be damned if I'll call my Commander and Chief foul names in an international forum. Hell, I didn't even do that when we had the self proclaimed adulterer in office a few years ago.

Eric

Psycluded · #2 Unread post by **Psycluded** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 3:34 am

You know, it really steams me to see people blame the president for every little inconvenience, every bit of misconduct from every government employee they ever hear about, every natural disaster, the response to them and the disasters themselves, I mean jeez... the President is the head of only one branch of government, he's not all-powerful. He isn't responsible for every little misstep of every little peon paper-pusher in the government.

If you want to really start laying some blame, lets start looking at Congress and the Supreme Court as well. There have been a lot more nutcases on capitol hill than in the white house, and they have done far more damage to the Constitution than any president ever has.

#3 Unread post by **cb360** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 4:44 am

" He isn't responsible for every little misstep of every little peon paper-pusher in the government. "

I don't suspect he is. But he is responsible for the appointment of the recently humiliated former director of FEMA. A man who had lost his last job (as some competition Arabian horse show judging) for incompetence and whose qualification for the job was that he had been a successful party fundraiser. Brown was nothing but an apparatchik. Anyone who can read is well aware of the fact that Brown was not only not the best man for the job... he shouldn't have even been the last name on a list of the best 10,000 people for the job! I know how politics work. I know awards are given to the party faithful on both sides of the fence - I don't even have a huge problem with it as long as the people are competent professionals. FEMA director is an important job that requires experience and specific knowledge. If you wanna make douchebags like him the undersecretary of this and that or the ambassador to some backwater - fine. But making him director of anything was a very poor choice and I don't think there's anything wrong calling a spade a spade. The president screwed up. When I screw up I get called on it - so should he. I don't hold the president responsible for a guard soldier screwing up in Iraq... but for choosing a moron to be director of FEMA... you bet I do.

Psycluded · #4 Unread post by **Psycluded** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:16 am

That's fine. The man (Bush) took responsibility for the FEMA foul-ups on national television and has taken steps to rectify the mistake. What more do you want? A public trial? Hold him legally accountable for every "preventable" death in the aftermath of Katrina and Rita by calling it criminal negligence?

#5 Unread post by **9000white** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:58 am

i thought all this was cleard up when the statement was made on national tv---"Bush don lak blacks"

oldnslo · #6 Unread post by **oldnslo** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:22 pm

GW had no choice but to swallow his pride a bit and choke on his enormous ego. The buck theoretically and figuratively stops with him and the appointments he makes. If he appoints an incompetent pal for a job and things go awry, who more then GW is ultimately responsible? The poor dork who thought he had the brass ring because GW hired him?
I was actually looking forward to a public crucifiction, but he took the blame for everything, and now everything is hunky-dory.
If history provides any lessons, GW will continue to hire the wrong people for important jobs until his ability to hire ends.

flynrider · #7 Unread post by **flynrider** » Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:47 pm

Everybody likes to put a name on the problem, but the way the system is designed (the political system), it's unlikely that the truly qualified people will ever get posted to the top positions for which the are best suited, unless it happens by chance or accident. The system doesn't work that way, no matter who's in charge.

I've had the misfortune of working with FEMA in disaster relief operations on numerous occasions, under both of the last presidential administrations. In nearly all cases, their presence tended to slow down relief efforts by other organizations that were actually qualified to provide help. When FEMA steps in, nothing moves until they tell you it can move. The problem was that they were never organized enough to allow anything to move. Didn't matter if it was a flood or a forest fire, they seemed to try to make things up as they went along. Organizations with actual plans and coordinated staff were left sitting and waiting for them to get their act together. FEMA has always been a pretty hopeless organization. It just becomes glaringly obvious when the disaster is major and high-profile.

Robkhb · #8 Unread post by **Robkhb** » Thu Sep 29, 2005 6:47 am

Whoever said that GWB isn't responsible for the actions of the federal government, I need to take a little bit of issue with that. Just like the head of a major corporation is absolutely responsible for everything that everyone below him does, so it is with the president. Have you ever managed people? If one of your employees did something wrong, you are responsible for their actions, it goes with being in charge. The problem is when you surround yourself with cronies and other corrupt people as GWB always does and continues to do, you can't turn around and be surprised when they are totally incompetent. Whoever made the comment about the "adulterer" just let it go already, I'm so tired of hearing about that. That is all my republican friends say "yeah sure we are in a globally unpopular war costing us thousands of lives and billions of dollars BUT THAT BILL CLINTON GOT A BJ FROM HIS INTERN!" Let it go people, his wife did so maybe we should.

oldnslo · #9 Unread post by **oldnslo** » Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:49 am

Only trouble is, Rob, that we don't really know that Hillary DID let it go. For all we know, she could be making him suffer in countless ways every day while smiling for the media. I wouldn't want her to be mad at me, she looks like one tough lady.

Robkhb · #10 Unread post by **Robkhb** » Thu Sep 29, 2005 9:26 am

oldnslo wrote:Only trouble is, Rob, that we don't really know that Hillary DID let it go. For all we know, she could be making him suffer in countless ways every day while smiling for the media. I wouldn't want her to be mad at me, she looks like one tough lady.

lol I agree, I wouldn't mess with her. However you look at it though, it's a private matter between him and her. I'll take BC over GWB any day.