Intro, thoughts and first bike alternatives discussion.

[Batan]

After being part of car scene for a while, my wife talked me into getting into bikes(yes, you read that right). So we decided on taking a MFS course and we have it booked for June. Despite being in early our 30s neither of us have ridden bikes before. Not the ones worth mentioning anyway.
I've been reading up on stuff for a while and one bad thing about a GS500 and EX500(next person that mentions them gets shot! LOL) is that, they are severely overpriced and what's worse very hard to come by, at least here. Seems like somebody came up with two of these as the holy grails of starter bikes, which I am not denying nor I have an authority to do so, but it also seems like everybody copies/pastes and repeats the same stuff online and internet is partially responsible for these bikes being so sought after, it's ridiculous. I find it hard to believe that there are not at least another 2-3 bikes that should be mentioned with them. Or are there? Like how many people have actually learned on them? And no two people began on two bikes since you only begin once which leaves us only with instructors at schools with the authority on the subject. They are the people that see a lot of beginners handle different bikes. And the best school in town that I chose has more then just those two bikes. In fact, they have a Ninja 500, but no GS500. And instead, I see them riding on different kinds of bikes. So obviously, there are others out there.
And now, flameuit on, onto my purchase. LOL After doing some research, I bought a bike that would not exactly be recommended as a learner bike. I got a '82 Honda CB750F. The bikes ticks a few boxes but it's heavy albeit balanced well. I'm 6' and 175lbs and my wife is just about 1/4" shorter then me.
I'm not arguing bike's weight. But what is interesting is, when you search internet for answers, the typical opinion is that it's too big being a 750cc and a big no-no because it's too powerful being 72hp(or 78, depending on the source). Nothing over 50hp is for beginners. However, power to weight ratio is in the exact same range as EX500 and GS500 which are hovering around that 50hp mark. For comparison, an example of a "stupid first bike decision", a CBR600, has the power to weight ratio that is more then twice as high! And CBR600 is tame compared to bikes hot-headed kids pick as the first bike.
As for the powerband, I of course cannot discuss it on the bike subject since I'm a newbie. I can say though that the F I got has a pretty friendly clutch/throttle response. It should also cost about $150 a year to insure since it qualifies for "collector" plates. Which is about 1/6 of base insurance w/o collector plates. It will not be ridden before the MFS though.
I will see in June if I change my mind and decide to get something smaller, the bike I got is nice, and should not be a problem to sell(I'd rather not, I like it a lot) but for now, here it is, might as well post a pic!


Any input, discussions welcome! Especially good examples of ALTERNATIVES to Ninja and GS. Feel free to flame me for my choice.
PS> No need to discuss how great EX500 and GS500 are.

Cheers from Vancouver!

[Brackstone]

I don't think anyone really recommends the 500cc bikes to beginners here. We just recommend them to people who simply REFUSE to start on a 250cc.

[Batan]

I don't think anyone really recommends the 500cc bikes to beginners here. We just recommend them to people who simply REFUSE to start on a 250cc.

It's not a matter of "here", it's a general recommendation. I'm not even talking about the CCs, but the fact that there are two bikes in general that are recommended. That's it.
And above, of course, is the way I see things. I will leave to others to offer alternatives to these two overpriced bikes.

And don't get me wrong, I would have snatched a GS500 if there were not scarce and overpriced, at least here in Vancouver.

[blues2cruise]

First of all.....

Secondly...your bike is terrific condition for being a 1982. It must have been well looked after.

I did not start on a 250....I have no interest in a sport style bike as in the Ninja....
.....and the 250 cruiser styles were just to little to be comfortable.

People can learn quite easily on a Yamaha 650 cruiser.....or other similar bikes.

Have fun with yours.

[Batan]

First of all.....

Secondly...your bike is terrific condition for being a 1982. It must have been well looked after.

I did not start on a 250....I have no interest in a sport style bike as in the Ninja....
.....and the 250 cruiser styles were just to little to be comfortable.

People can learn quite easily on a Yamaha 650 cruiser.....or other similar bikes.

Have fun with yours.

Thanks. One of the reasons I could not say no was that, it IS in a nice shape which is rare for bikes of any bike of that vintage. As I said it ticked all the boxes of what I wanted from the first bike(other then the mentioned weight). I too am not terribly concerned about the speed nor tyipcal sport bikes. I like standard and naked bikes, like a Ducati Monster or the one I bought. Funny, back then it was considered a sports bike. I would not mind some touring either later this summer. A trip or two. We'll see.

[storysunfolding]

It's a beautiful bike. I'm not going to say it's a good idea as a first bike, but I agree the weight will make up for the power of the motor... a bit. It still packs a punch though so be careful.

I will however recommend a DOHC version over the old K series with it's SOHC. Your bike rides like a dream compared to the older model.

Anyway you have the heavy weight and the punch of a powerful I-4 to contend with. It'll make learning a little harder.

Oh- and throw your location up in your sig so we can say things like "That is so like a guy from Minnesota*" or whatnot


*No offense to the proud people of the city of Minnesota

[TorontoBoy]

Your MSF course is scheduled for June, and you bought a CB750 SS. To me this situation sounds like a crash waiting to happen. Really, let's be totally honest: You know nothing about motorcycling, and that's Ok. Your car background does not prepare you for safely riding a motorcycle. Your bike is older but it is still a supersport bike, make no mistake about it. Give yourself a better chance of learning to properly ride with a better suited beginner bike. For your second bike ride whatever you want.

Motorcycling is unlike driving a car, but you won't know this until you do it. Almost anyone can get into the seat of an expensive sports car and drive reasonably well. On a SS bike you'll crash. These bikes are street legal racing bikes for people with enough motorcycling racing experience. Those double disks in front should stop you pretty well, too well for a beginner bike. And only 75hp, you say? That's a whole lot of HP to move a bike, way more than a beginner should have.

I recommend, for you and your wife's personal safety, as well as the paintjob of your bike, to park it and get something more conducive to learning. A 250, a Vulcan 500, a Honda VLX 650. There are lots of bikes to choose. I'm unsure why you believe a CB750 SS is suitable for you. It's your life and your money. Have you checked out insurance for your CB750 SS?

http://www.chuckhawks.com/good_first_motorcycles.htm

[Batan]

Your MSF course is scheduled for June, and you bought a CB750 SS. To me this situation sounds like a crash waiting to happen. Really, let's be totally honest: You know nothing about motorcycling, and that's Ok. Your car background does not prepare you for safely riding a motorcycle. Your bike is older but it is still a supersport bike, make no mistake about it. Give yourself a better chance of learning to properly ride with a better suited beginner bike. For your second bike ride whatever you want.

Motorcycling is unlike driving a car, but you won't know this until you do it. Almost anyone can get into the seat of an expensive sports car and drive reasonably well. On a SS bike you'll crash. These bikes are street legal racing bikes for people with enough motorcycling racing experience. Those double disks in front should stop you pretty well, too well for a beginner bike. And only 75hp, you say? That's a whole lot of HP to move a bike, way more than a beginner should have.

I recommend, for you and your wife's personal safety, as well as the paintjob of your bike, to park it and get something more conducive to learning. A 250, a Vulcan 500, a Honda VLX 650. There are lots of bikes to choose. I'm unsure why you believe a CB750 SS is suitable for you. It's your life and your money. Have you checked out insurance for your CB750 SS?

http://www.chuckhawks.com/good_first_motorcycles.htm

Yes, the car background has nothing to do with it, other then I'm not that mechanically afraid of a 26 year old aircooled bike. Why would you assume I thought it did?(prepare me somehow for motorcycling?) I mentioned it because part of this post is introduction. And the insurance(did you read my whole post or just scanned over it?), is about $150 a year - collector plates in BC rates since it's older then 25 years. A GS500 would be about 6-700 just for base insurance. But insurance is not the point now is it... just one of the factors. Another factor is, again, above mentioned overpricing and unavailability of learner bikes.

As I said(yet again), I'd gladly take a GS500. But there is none. Ninjas are nowhere to be found either or expensive. Buell Blasts, as much as I like them, don't have the greatest record.

"And only 75HP you say?" - now where did I say ONLY 75HP? I gave a simple calculation of power. 75HP is definitely a lot for a bike since even a heaviest bikes are just over 800lbs and hell, one of my cars has a 53hp engine, the car weighs 1800lbs. The post like these is what I'm trying to elaborate on. What did you learn on? How was it? That helps. And apparently those double discs on the F don't grab THAT great.

It is frustrating because you can't discuss this with anybody on the forums as you throat gets jumped more or less right away. It's like an On/Off switch. For example, you completely disregarded the fact I stated I'd take one of the learner bikes and gave me more or less the same automatic reply a 16 year old with an R1 would get. I also left room for perhaps getting a different bike once we're through with the course.
You did contribute with some other examples of beginner bikes, so thumbs up for that and thank you.

PS> There is another thread on here with somebody talking about his experience with SV650 and he's getting flamed for simply telling us about his experience.

[storysunfolding]

He's getting flak b/c he seems to suggest that starting on an SV650 is a great idea. The overall opinion of this and many boards points towards it being a gray area bike at best.

Anyway- I wouldn't consider your bike a supersport. I think if there's truely a weak used market around you that it's an ok bike to learn on. As you pointed out, it's power to weight ratio is low. An sv650 for example also puts out 70 hp and is again not an ideal first bike but is 200lbs lighter. I put this just slightly above a vulcan 500 on the scale of beginner bikes. Similar seating position, and handling, same weight but more power from your I-4. Be careful with that extra power and make sure you practice well away from others and hard objects initially.

[Batan]

He's getting flak b/c he seems to suggest that starting on an SV650 is a great idea. The overall opinion of this and many boards points towards it being a gray area bike at best.

Anyway- I wouldn't consider your bike a supersport. I think if there's truely a weak used market around you that it's an ok bike to learn on. As you pointed out, it's power to weight ratio is low. An sv650 for example also puts out 70 hp and is again not an ideal first bike but is 200lbs lighter. I put this just slightly above a vulcan 500 on the scale of beginner bikes. Similar seating position, and handling, same weight but more power from your I-4. Be careful with that extra power and make sure you practice well away from others and hard objects initially.

LOL, I just checked the weight on it too(the SV650). More power to weight then the CB. I've read his initial post and it didn't come across like he was suggesting it, his point seemed to be "not a great idea but doable". Anyway, I'll leave that for that thread. Also, CBs throttle is lazy compared to modern bikes. Although, with "hit the pothole and twist the wrist" situation that would not matter much, it'd take off anyway, but in slow riding situations it would.
If I indeed decide that I will learn on the CB, I might possibly limit the throttle for a while. That would help.