JackoftheGreen wrote:If we're going to accept bikes with sidecars and trikes as 'real' bikes, I fail to understand why the Spyder doesn't get a pass too.
I suspect it's mostly because of aesthetics. Hacks and trikes still look familiar in a comforting sort of way; they're just motorcycles that have been modified. The Spyder has been designed and engineered from the start to be a three wheeler. I'm not exactly a traditionalist, but it looks unnerving to me. It doesn't fit my idea of what a motorcycle should look or be like.
"If you ride like there's no tomorrow, there won't be."
A motorcycle with a sidecar is a motorcycle ... with a sidecar. The sidecar can be removed and hacks have an established tradition in the history of motorcycling. They are also ultra cool babe magnets. I don't feel the same way about vehicles that are engineered from the ground up as sidecar rigs which will never run without the sidecar even if this type of specialized vehicle has been used in sidecar racing.
At one time the vast majority of trikes where motorcycles that where converted to trikes. Personally, I don't like them, but the genesis is rather obvious even if a person can now purchase a trike new from a dealer.
From an engineering standpoint, the Can-Am configuration has advantages over both hacks and trikes, but they where never motorcycles. Furthermore, they are marketed to new operators as an easy to ride alternative to riding a motorcycle in direct competition with motorcycles. There are certainly motorcycle riders who are moving to Can-Am products for many reasons, most notably for physical disability, but BRP is also aggressively marketing the Can-Am to new riders as an alternative to motorcycles.
"Cred"... There are lots of people engaged in lots of different motor-sport and I don't have a problem with any of them so long as their behavior is civil and considerate. I am in no position to attribute any 'cred' to anyone enjoying any motor-sport but some vehicles are motorcycles and some are not.
Bicycle - lacks only a motor - an embryonic motorcycle.
Moped - a motorcycle with vestigial pedals.
Scooter - a motorcycle with a step-through frame.
Motorcycle - single track two wheeled motorized vehicle.
Hack - a motorcycle with a sidecar attached. Detach the sidecar and it is a motorcycle again.
Trike - at least it was once a motorcycle.
Can-Am - it was never a motorcycle.
Dune buggy
Convertible
Cage
When it comes to three wheeled vehicles configured with two wheels in front and one in the back, whatever that is, then the Can-Am is an easy awesome as Can-Am provides the sector dominating product line for three wheels vehicles with two wheels in front. At the same time a Can-Am is an utter fail as a motorcycle because it is simply not a motorcycle any more than a dune buggy is a motorcycle or a Morgan or a bicycle.
When Mike offers up a carbon fiber Cervelo P5 TT bike on the Total Motorcycle Cool Wall, that will likewise rate a fail, although I would argue that the Cervelo is a lot closer to being a motorcycle than a Can-Am Spider RT especially if a Tony Martin or a Fabian Cancellara is providing the motive force.
The Spyder boasts a saddle, which the rider straddles, floorboards, and hand and foot controls that an MC rider would find familiar, if not comfortable. Compare that to something like the Merlin Roadster, which though three-wheeled is clearly not a motorcycle.
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Though cool, this looks more like a woman's slipper than anything else. (-: Despite that, the Merlin is a regular feature at Sturgis and the manufacturer, Corbin, has more than enough street cred among the motorcycle crowd to pass this off. Of course, it's powered by an hDavidson big twin, so that lends something to the fan base.
Either way, the Spyder is here to stay and the new blood they bring to our community is a positive thing.
An interesting note; I've just been parousing the previous Spyder offerings on our Cool Wall, and it's amazing the way nobody's opinion of the Spyder has budged at all in three years. Nearly all of us regular voters have said more the less the same thing about the Spyder each time it's presented -- this is not the first time I've posted a pic of the Corbin, nor is it the first time the Spyder has been compared to a snowmobile in a positive way, and in a negative way. And numerous posters have presented the "it's an awesome whatever-it-is, but it's not a motorcycle so, no vote" argument. Curiously enough though, this is so far the worst the Spyder has done on the Cool Wall, and by a fair margin too.
Interesting that the last RT we featured was arguably quite well received, while this one languishes. Of course, we're about 20 votes or so short from previous years so far, so maybe there's a mess of favorable votes coming in soon?
Either way, quite a drastic down-turn for the Spyder this year. Let's hope the boys at Can-Am are paying attention.
(edited once for table clarity)
As "street cred" came up again, and as I was not sure that I had an accurate understanding of the term, I looked it up in an online urban dictionary which had no less then 16 definitions listed for "street cred", most of which related to black American subculture and some of which where quite offensive and racist. I am still not certain how a vehicle manufacturer gains street cred, but I am, after researching the term, quite resolved to the ugly reality that anyone who has Googled "street cred" has none, and those that publicly confess that they did so likely have even less. One definition attempted to provide a quantitative system to evaluate an individuals street cred with various factors having different point values, both additive and subtractive. My point total was embarrassingly negative, but as this was also one of the more offensively racist definitions for the term I do not take that result as dispositive.
Hanson wrote:My point total was embarrassingly negative, but as this was also one of the more offensively racist definitions for the term I do not take that result as dispositive.
Lighten up, Francis. Some definitions are just not found in places like the Urban Dictionary. "Street Cred", as it applies to motorcycles, simply means the brand has an established name and reputation. Royal Enfield, for example, has "street cred" because it has been around since 1955 and is arguably one of the few motorcycles you could park beside a row of 1%er bikes and not get into trouble for it.
Well, after a long hard think about it, I chose: Cool.
Yes, it's definitely a question of what category it fits into and if it's a motorcycle or car or snowmobile with wheels...but why I voted cool for it is it's unique, it's not going away (anytime soon is seems) and it gives that "wind in your face" feeling we all love and refuses to "fit in" to a category.
Do I personally consider a Spyder to be a motorcycle? No, in fact, you don't even need a motorcycle license to ride one (or so Can-Am says), so even the gov't doesn't consider it one. But it does have properties of a bike and of that a car, but if I had to put a 51/49% down, it would be 51% bike.
Does it deserve to be on Total Motorcycle? Why not. It's a 3 wheeled bike that defies logic but yet defines a lifestyle.
Hanson, I assure you I certainly meant nothing racist nor offensive in my use of the phrase 'street cred'. As Gummi said, I use the phrase to indicate a certain level of authority, validity and respect for either a brand or another rider. And although that sounds condescending, at least where another rider is concerned, it really isn't. We find ourselves in a position to judge other riders for practical reasons all the time, whether they're being civil or not, and I'll give you a couple examples --
You're pulling into a roadside diner for a lunch stop, and there are several other bikes in the parking lot. Which bike do you park next to? The brand-new HD Road King with a softball sized dent in the tank and spotless chrome? Or the ten year old Suzi Intruder that, though undented, has dull chrome, water spots and 1/4 inch of bug guts caked to the windshield? I park next to the Suzi, because I believe the rider of that machine is less likely to accidentally kick over my scoot while mounting theirs.
Or, you're out on a road trip and you've pulled into a rest stop where several other riders are catching some shade. Your map shows a road a few miles ahead that looks like a great bit of twisty, but you're concerned about the condition of the asphalt and would like to ask some of the other riders present if they came that way and what to expect. How do you decide which rider to talk to? Whether you base it on their gear, their rides, their general demeanor or some other 'sense' of their character, you've just 'attributed cred' to another rider based on your perception of them. It is the acknowledgement of this respect I refer to when I speak of attributing cred to another rider, and being in a position to do so is simply part of the lifestyle.
Mike 
