Trouble starting... do I put penetrating oil in cylinders?

[storysunfolding]

So, the 81 XS 400 has been sitting for awhile and I can't get it started. I have a new starter, I have good spark (See it in daylight), it has fuel (cleaned out the carb so I can only assume really), it has compression (blows my fingers off spark plug hole).

The problem, The starter will start and run to a point where it doesn't want to turn anymore. At that point, if I use the kick starter I have fierce resistance. I can get it to turn over but it takes alot more force than I believe is necessary. I don't think the cylinders are stuck because with teh spark plugs out the starter has the pistons going like mad

Could it be that after all the time sitting that the cylinders need a bit of oil? It seems like they just need a bit of coaxing and she'd fire right up.

Any ideas? Am I way off here? Supposing penetrating oil couldn't hurt, how much should I put in? Or maybe there's something I'm missing?

[Gadjet]

Silly question maybe, but are you getting fuel to the cylinders?

It sounds like you have good compression, and you have spark, so the only thing missing is fuel.

disconnect the fuel line between the petcock and the carburetor, then run another line off the petcock and into a catch bottle. then try cranking the engine over with the starter. If your petcock is working properly (set to 'On' or 'Res' position) and you are getting proper vaccuum to it, you should get fuel running into your catch bottle when you try cranking the engine.

If you don't get any fuel flowing, then you have one of three problems

1 - your fuel tank is empty
2 - your petcock is plugged up and will require a thorough disassembly and cleaning
3 - you are not getting vaccuum to the petcock - check for leaks on the vaccuum line going to the petcock

[storysunfolding]

Fuel is fine from the tank, nice stream.

Battery is fine, all electrical is in order.

A guy at motorcycleusa guessed the engine to be very out of time. What does that mean and how does one fix that?

There is compression, I don't have a gauge to measure it but I guess I'll buy one tomorrow to see what it's reading.

I'll try to clarify the starter more. The electric starter cannot turn the engine over. It won't turn the engine through points of full compression. It's even damned hard to use the kick start here. I think there is something wrong because even with jumping and using all my weight 165 lbs to come down on the kickstart, it doesn't want to move fast until it leaves a state of full compression. Again, it's fine if the spark plugs are out, without pressure building up in the cylinder she turns like a champ. Could there be extra resistance on the system anywhere? Would a stuck valve or something explain this? I don't think it's electrical, or fuel related, but I could be wrong. I know the 400 cc is bigger than my 125cc dirt bike, but on the dirt bike the kick start gives me a nice thwup thwup thwup of the engine turning over a few times. On the xs 400 I'm not sure that I'm getting a full revolution, just stopping as the second cylinder starts to compress.

Any thoughts, ideas or prayers?

[BuzZz]

Something sounds like it's getting tight, but pretty hard to figure out what without seeing the bike... there is oil in the bike, right?

You can pour a spoonful of the same oil your run in the crankcase down each plug hole. Turn the engine over with the kickstarter slowly a few revolutions, then hold a rag in front of the plug holes and run it on the electric starter to get rid of any excess oil. If it is a lube problem(can't really see it myself, but who knows) this should help it in the short term, anyway.

I wonder if the guy who said it was out of time meant that the cam drive has jumped and the cam is out of time with the crank....?

[storysunfolding]

How does one get a timing chain back to where it should be?

[9000white]

a timing chain out of time aint gonna give you more compression.
a carburetor leaking fuel in the cylinder will.

[storysunfolding]

how would I check for that or fix it?

[9000white]

put the sparkplugs in it and let it sit overnight.
pull plugs in morning and crank engine over to see if gas blows out one of the cylinders.there are a few things that can cause this--see if that is what it is then we will go from there.also check to see if it is overfull of oil.this is indication of carb leaking into cylinder.

[storysunfolding]

Well she was sitting all day with teh plugs in, so I gave it a go, no gas came out. Oil level is the same as when I put some in yesterday.

[peterman]

After cranking it for a while with the electric starter did happen to pull the plugs?

If so did you smell gas? That would be a good indication that gas is getting to the cylinders, also if the plugs are wet, that would be another good indication. If the plugs are dry and/or they don't smell like gas I would bet that you aren't getting gas in there.