MSF course question?

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IcyHound · #11 Unread post by **IcyHound** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 1:38 am

Very much worth it. It starts from the basics and you learn to control your bike not just move the controls around and hope for the best. Then you go out and practice and fine tune but it gives an excellent foundation.

Since you get a bike to beat up and practice things like braking and swerving and dealing with panic situations and you find out that going over something isn't always the end of the world, you're decreasing your chances of doing something brilliant like snapping open the throttle and slamming yourself into the side of a building after you dump the clutch.

Sun Jun 17, 2007 1:45 am

It was worth it. It pointed out some bad habbits that I had picked up from riding in dirt (like braking mid corner, and not holding knees in). And the coolest part was watching one of the instructers ride the course side saddle.

jstark47 · #13 Unread post by **jstark47** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 7:01 am

It's like building a house. The MSF course sets the solid foundation for you to build your skills on. What's the value of a foundation? Well, the house is kinda worthless without it...

Jeremy102579 · Sun Jun 17, 2007 7:31 am

like i said, i only have time to go out with a licensed rider on the weekends.........i am planning on once i get my license in august, to go out by myself that day and cruise wherever i wish.

is that smart to do once i get my own license?

inpayne · #15 Unread post by **inpayne** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 4:42 am

matthew5656 wrote:In Colorado I have found several different schools and all of them price their basic rider course around $200-$300. I found a few schools for $250. It could be more or less in Wisconsin, but it's definitely affordable.

Thats what I assumed it was....

Since i'm under 18 I have to take one to get a lissence in the state of wisconsin, that and my parents would make me take it anyway.

slimcolo · #16 Unread post by **slimcolo** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 5:56 am

I would like to see a comparison of MSF and other classes. I have seen other classes advertised and was wondering if any one,who has also taken MSF has taken any of the others. (particuarly Evergreen Saftey Council WA)
I know that many states have ABATE taught classes. These however are MSF classes taught by Abate Inst. and in Colorado partially funded by surcharge on MC licence plates. (even the books are MSF)
Military motorcycle classes are also MSF (at least when I was in)usually taught by a NCO that has been through the MSF instructor training. Instructors may add to MSF (the class I took in the Army added about 4 extra hours on maintenance) but cannot take away or leave out anything.
I've heard (not verified) that Wyoming offers MSF class for $15. In most states they run around $150-$300 for basic class.
Some organizations (BMWMOA) will offer cheaper classes at their rallys. (These are MSF classes, but are normally limited to the advanced class. some companies will also reimburse employees who take a saftey class, not to mention cheaper insurance rates)Some larger dealerships (and manufactures)also offer classes, still others will pay some or all fees for class if you bought a bike from them.
Most classes require you to be of ride-able age (16 in most states) but may require parents signature if under 18.

tropicalhotdog · Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:44 am

I took the course after I got my license (recently), and like everyone above I can't recommend it highly enough. One caveat though -- my girlfriend took it with me, thinking that it would be a real beginner's course. She had never tried driving a bike, nor had even driven a standard transmission car, before and so was a true "beginner" (unlike every other rider there, who had SOME experience). Needless to say, she had to drop out of the class 20 minutes into the range. An instructer yelling "NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL!" in your face when you don't even know where to find neutral is not really helpful. But MSF applied the course fees toward a private instructor, who was godlike in his patience and awesome teaching skills and so now she's ready for the course again. We (meaning I) have to pay for the BRC again though. Hey, whatever it takes to prep for the cross-country ride honeymoon, right?

tortus · #18 Unread post by **tortus** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:46 am

tropicalhotdog wrote:An instructer yelling "NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL!" in your face when you don't even know where to find neutral is not really helpful.

Wow. That doesn't sound right at all. When i took the MSF there were several people that couldn't even drive a manual car, let alone a bike.

tropicalhotdog · Mon Jun 18, 2007 6:53 am

Yeah, it wasn't quite what we expected in terms of "instruction." But she felt bad slowing down the rest of the class, and the guy in Williamsburg Brooklyn who gave her the private lessons more than made up for the initial bad vibe.

Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:22 am

tortus wrote:
tropicalhotdog wrote:An instructer yelling "NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL! NEUTRAL!" in your face when you don't even know where to find neutral is not really helpful.
Wow. That doesn't sound right at all. When i took the MSF there were several people that couldn't even drive a manual car, let alone a bike.

That's the sign of a bad instructor. I've had many people show up that have never driven a manual transmission or been on a bike before. It is truely a beginner class or that first exercise with group rocking could only have been designed to "pee" people off.

Hell, some of the bikes are hard as hell to get into nuetral so to give a student more riding time I tell them a few tricks, and if they are still having trouble I do it for them. The point of the exercise isn't to find nuetral so it doesn't take anything away from the lesson and they are all able to do it on their own by the end of the weekend anyway.

There are quite a few courses in my area that interest me. I teach the MSF courses but these pique my interest as well.

www.stayinsafe.com which provides on road training to experienced riders through a multiday ride. They use radios to communicate with the students (one way, only the instructor can talk). One student rides in the lead with the instructor behind to critique their technique. Behind the instructor are the other students who are able to observe what the rider is doing wrong and apply it to their own riding. The lead changes constantly. Pricey but apparently incredible.

The other is a local one I ran into this weekend. It's motorcycle riding concepts in fairfax Va http://www.saddleupva.com and it's run by 5 police motorcyclists. You have 12 students and 4-5 instructors. You don't get a license waiver but they claim to offer a much better program than the MSF (always a good marketing strategy). 18 hours of instruction instead of 15 (BRC minimum) smaller instructor to student ratio 6:1 (MSF) compared to the 3:1 (MRC).

I think any instruction is great. The MSF is a good standard because it's fairly ubiquitous in the U.S. but by no means is it perfect as referenced by Sargent jerk instructor mentioned previously

p.s.- the forum has spell check now? That's amazing